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Movies I've seen lately

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C Elegans
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Post by C Elegans »

Originally posted by Dottie
Would be happy if anyone explaines exactly whats so great about this one, Is there some historic reason? Or am I just incapable of understanding the true meaning of it?

Thank god movie culture have evolved since back then... ;)
It was ages ago I saw it, and the copy was very bad quality indeed, but IIRC, the major point is the epic story, the rise and fall of this media magnate and what his "empire" symbolises.

Hm, perhaps I start to understand now what you said previously about getting a feeling of missing something in all movies and books that are supposed to be good... :D ;)
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Post by Georgi »

Originally posted by Morlock
My score of the movie is pretty negitive, but I can't bring myself to give a bad score to a Spielberg/Williams movie.
Take what you want from that.
... :rolleyes: :p :D

I actually thought JP2 was worse than JP3... but then, they're both so bad... :D

I watched 2001: A Space Odyssey this weekend. All I have to say is... :confused:

Oh, and if I get around to it sometime, I might actually post reviews of Resident Evil, and Jason X...
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Post by fable »

Originally posted by Dottie
Watched Citizen Kane today. Yeah I know its considered a classic and that I should have seen it before, but anyway...

This was probably one of the most dissapointing movies I've ever seen. I cant at all understand why as liked as it is... If I understood it correctly its suppsed to be some statement about what money can buy, but the plot is utterly boring and in addition you have to suffer through atempts of "humor" every now and then. In the entire first half of the movie every scene also gives a silly and chaotic impression.

Would be happy if anyone explaines exactly whats so great about this one, Is there some historic reason? Or am I just incapable of understanding the true meaning of it?
First, technique. Citizen Kane was the first Hollywood film to break with the overwhelming German UFA style that developed in the mid 1920s. Instead of being rich, romantic, subtly lit and accompanied by slurping strings, Citizen Kane was fast-paced, jagged, filled with unbalanced shadows and had a gutsy score. It annoyed the hell out of the Hollywood conservatives who ruled the roost. That one scene, for instance, where the hero and his wife show their deteriorating relationship over the dinnertable in conversation as the years fly by, is now considered a classic textbook illustration of how to tell a story through symbols.

Second, the story is based (loosely!) on the life of William Randolph Hearst, the first of the big newspaper tycoons, the man who invented "yellow journalism." As such, it was viewed as a dirty laundry film, a look behind the scenes, which it wasn't. but the man who wrote the film had it in for Hearst, and deliberately made him, and his girlfriend, look terrible in it.

Third, as a synthesis of directing, acting, music and script, it is brilliant. (The team of actors that worked with Welles were people he had known and acted with for more than a decade, ther Mercury Theater crew. People like Joseph Cotton and Agnes Morehead were rightly accounted among the most brilliant character actors in the US.) It is an extremely "tight" film; there are no weak or wobbly moments. Everything contributes to effect. It is enormously concentrated, and doesn't yield one-quarter its value at a first sitting.

Fourth, it is a story that can be taken at several levels, without ever pushing too hard at any. It is a morality tale about losing one's soul in the search of money. It is a tragedy of character, as we follow a person who keeps catching on to what he's lost one step to late all the time down the road of life, until he realizes, on his deathbed, what he truly lacked and wished for, most--too late. It is a mystery: what do the hero's last words mean?

If you didn't like it, don't bother seeing it, again. But if you're curious about it, try it a second time, keeping the above in mind. Try to see it after seeing some very good 1930s Hollywood films; that will give you a sense of what a monster Citizen Kane was to the tinsel city, and why so many higher-ups were delighted when it wasn't an overnight success.
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Post by C Elegans »

Originally posted by Georgi
I watched 2001: A Space Odyssey this weekend. All I have to say is... :confused:
I was ages ago I saw this one too, but at least it was in holocen, not back in triassic... ;) What were you confused about? I remember I had this discussion with someone (perhaps Morlock? and somebody else too) previously on the board, it seems many people get confused by 2001, especially by the monolithe and the ending.
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Post by Georgi »

Originally posted by C Elegans
I was ages ago I saw this one too, but at least it was in holocen, not back in triassic... What were you confused about? I remember I had this discussion with someone (perhaps Morlock? and somebody else too) previously on the board, it seems many people get confused by 2001, especially by the monolithe and the ending.
Oh, you know, the whole thing... Well, ok, mostly the monolith, the ending, and whether there was actually supposed to be some kind of point to it... ;)
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Post by fable »

Originally posted by Georgi


Oh, you know, the whole thing... Well, ok, mostly the monolith, the ending, and whether there was actually supposed to be some kind of point to it... ;)
I think you had to walk through the monolith to understand that film, frankly.
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Post by Dottie »

Originally posted by fable
It is a morality tale about losing one's soul in the search of money.
This was the only moral of the story I could see when I saw it, I dont think its anything worong with that, but it didnt to make up for an imo bad movie.

If you didn't like it, don't bother seeing it, again. But if you're curious about it, try it a second time, keeping the above in mind. Try to see it after seeing some very good 1930s Hollywood films; that will give you a sense of what a monster Citizen Kane was to the tinsel city, and why so many higher-ups were delighted when it wasn't an overnight success.
I must admitt the only hollywood movie I've seen from 1930 or earlier is the General, and yes compared to that one this is indeed a masterpice. Being a silent movie the General had a inherent handicap though. (not that I think it would have helped ;) ) I will probably not suffer through Kane a second time, but I guess part of the reason I hated it was the very high expectations i've got from hearing others opinion on it.

Thanks for the reply anyway, I think you have enlightened me somewhat on the subject. ;)
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Post by fable »

Oh, I wouldn't compare it to the General. That was pre-UFA, pre-German, pure Buster Keaton, and a masterpiece--some have said, the greatest comedy ever made. (I won't say that, but I do think it was one of the greatest comedies ever filmed.) But check out some of the Garbo films, like Camille, or even a superlative 30's comedy like Ninotchka, by the great German-moved-to-US director/producer, Ernst Lubitsch. These are wonderful films, but they set a style which still has its influence on Hollywood, today. By contrast, Citizen Kane is unsetlling--deliberately so. Like its subject, it's filled with energy, brash, fast-moving, hard to follow, etc. Would you believe that the producers of Hill Street Blues cited Citizen Kane as a major influence on their show? And if you watch their first season, you'd see why: it had that same feeling of "What the hell is going on, here, I only caught half of that!" in whatever you saw. Welles wanted a complete change of pace, and got that. It was the only time he had his complete way with a studio. After that, his films, once made, were changed at the whim of others whom he never even met. It turned him into a cynical, bitter man, who eventually gave up making films.
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Post by Dottie »

Originally posted by fable
Oh, I wouldn't compare it to the General. That was pre-UFA, pre-German, pure Buster Keaton, and a masterpiece--some have said, the greatest comedy ever made. (I won't say that, but I do think it was one of the greatest comedies ever filmed.)
I dont understand the distinction between 'filmed' and 'made' here.

But check out some of the Garbo films, like Camille, or even a superlative 30's comedy like Ninotchka, by the great German-moved-to-US director/producer, Ernst Lubitsch. These are wonderful films, but they set a style which still has its influence on Hollywood, today. By contrast, Citizen Kane is unsetlling--deliberately so. Like its subject, it's filled with energy, brash, fast-moving, hard to follow, etc. Would you believe that the producers of Hill Street Blues cited Citizen Kane as a major influence on their show? And if you watch their first season, you'd see why: it had that same feeling of "What the hell is going on, here, I only caught half of that!" in whatever you saw. Welles wanted a complete change of pace, and got that. It was the only time he had his complete way with a studio. After that, his films, once made, were changed at the whim of others whom he never even met. It turned him into a cynical, bitter man, who eventually gave up making films.
I do get the feeling we have watched a different movie here. :rolleyes: ;) But If I get the chance to see Ninotchka (I probably will but it may take a while) I will think of this. :)
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Post by fable »

In the entire first half of the movie every scene also gives a silly and chaotic impression.

This chaotic impression was what I meant by pointing out the influence CK has had on Hill Street Blues, which (during its first season) utilized a similar feeling of (carefully prepared) chaotic nature to create a mood of enormous, not completely controlled energy. Kane's plot, by the way, is its character. It's a character study; that's all. Again, that differs from nearly everything Hollywood had done up until that time.

But if you don't like it, that's fine. Nobody says you have to like anything, nor should they. I'm only suggesting was to learn to understand, if you want to--but again, that's not necessary, either. :)
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Post by C Elegans »

@Dottie: Asch, what a pity you hated it, I was actually going to suggest we'd see it together since it was over 15, perhaps 20 years ago I saw it. Well I guess you don't like Battleship Potemkin a lot either, then. When you are used to modern film, it is sometime difficult to see throught the disturbing fog that silent movies, the jerky and fast way people move etc., creates between you and the movie.
posted by Georgi
Oh, you know, the whole thing... Well, ok, mostly the monolith, the ending, and whether there was actually supposed to be some kind of point to it...
posted by fable
I think you had to walk through the monolith to understand that film, frankly.
@Fable: ROFL :D
@Georgi: Fable is very right here. This is my take on the story, it's a good thing Fable is here since it's about 10 years I saw it, but I liked it a lot.

The monolith symbolises "the next major step in evolution" so to speak, it can symbolise intelligence or awareness. When it comes to the hominids in the beginning of the movie, they learn language, they learn to use tools - and they learn war. There is a very strong scence where one hominid picks up a bone, and IIRC, realised he can use it as a weapon, and the cut ends with him brawling out his victory to the sky.
I don't remember the details very well, but the human (well) embroy that floats through space in the end, is a new life form, the next step, the future intelligent life form spreading through the universe. (The whole idea of "a new type of human beings" is further underscored by the use of Richard Strauss Also Sprach Zarathustra in the movie.)

The Hal thing I'm sure you understood, that's the usual stuff with man creating a sentinel that should mimick himself, and eventually it gets a will of it's own and proves destructive. The failure of Hal is also the failure of the current technologic soceity and the end of the "tool-making" man's era. The main person (I have forgotten his name) gets sucked into the "energy field" or void or whatever that is the nature of the monolith, and is reborn as a new, more evolved, kind of human being, and becomes the fetus in the end.

Any more questions? (I am aware of that my summary is very crude and schematic, but that's the main story IMO) I'm actually quite keen on discussing one of the few sci-fi movies I've seen that I've really liked. :D
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Post by Dottie »

Originally posted by C Elegans
@Dottie: Asch, what a pity you hated it, I was actually going to suggest we'd see it together since it was over 15, perhaps 20 years ago I saw it. Well I guess you don't like Battleship Potemkin a lot either, then. When you are used to modern film, it is sometime difficult to see throught the disturbing fog that silent movies, the jerky and fast way people move etc., creates between you and the movie.
I havnt seen Battleship Potemkin but i definatly would like to. And i do not like old movies per default, Metropolis is still one of my favourites. :)

@Fable: I very much apreciate that you recognize my right to be wrong. :D ;)


Edit: There is another reason (perhaps abit unfair) why I disliked Citizen Kane. There is a swedish actor called Gösta Ekman who have made quite many movies here. When I was younger I watched some of them with my parents and such. One of the things that is present in all his movies is unmotivated clumsyness (ie he trips over things) I didnt think it was funny then, And at one point I just got fed up with it. So nowdays I more or less puke whenever any movie use such a scene, and I belive it was one or two in Citizen Kane.
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Post by C Elegans »

Gösta Ekman :eek: I had choosen to forget about him :eek: I am happy that we are the only two here who shares this nauseating cultural heritage :rolleyes:
Originally posted by Dottie
I havnt seen Battleship Potemkin but i definatly would like to. And i do not like old movies per default, Metropolis is still one of my favourites. :)
Battleship Potemkin is a masterpiece IMO. It took me a while, perhaps 15-20 minutes, to get used to that it is a silent movie with text presented on the screen every now and then. I haven't seem Metropolis though, although I think the hubby has in on DVD :o
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Post by fable »

@Fable: I very much apreciate that you recognize my right to be wrong.

You know that's not what I meant, silly. ;) I recognize your right to be right, since there are no wrongs in such matters. :)

Battleship Potemkin is a great film, mostly for that wonderful Odessa Steps sequence. Funny thing is, it never occurred, but many people wrote to tell Eisenstein that they remembered the events he depicted quite clearly. Yet Eisenstein had seen the steps and told his crew, "Hey, this would make a great place to show the inexorable progress of the Czar's army mowing down civilians!"

Ironically, the same thing happened to Buster Keaton and The General. There were plenty of Civil War veterans who swore they'd been at the exact sites he filmed in. But Keaton, who directed The General as well a starred in it, filmed the work in Oregon, which was the only state to possess a significant portion of track capable of running the c 1860s train he used through much of the footage. However, he managed to make it look like the old series of pictures taken during the war for newspapers, and caught the feeling of the place and time. This again convinced people of the reality they were seeing--when it wasn't there, at all. ;)
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Post by Morlock »

I today saw two classics:

A Man For All Seasons
Paul Scofield gives one of the best preformances ever by an actor as Sir Thomas Moore, the Catholic priest who was executed for not agreeing to devorce King Henry VIII.

The movie has a great script, which, with Scofield's delivery, is multiplied several times.

It was interesting to me, as I've always seen it (and I think history has to) as the mean old Catholics vs. The great Henry VIII.
So this is the only time I've seen it as the mean King Vs. The great Catholic.

I loved Robert Shaw's preformance as Henry. I think it's sort of sad, that this great actor, who has made several memorable roles, was never the first choice. In 'Jaws', 'From Russia With Love', 'The Sting' and This he was at least third choice.
I think it was good that the last scene with Shaw is one where he wants to see Scofield, as a friend. Afterwards he is only mentioned.

I was surprised to see a cameo by Orson Wells, although it was during his sell out period.

9/10

David Lean's Great Expectations
This is a wonderful adaptation of Charles Dikens' (cencorship, not stupidity) book, and widley concidered the best one.

I now am convineced, even hough just seeing four of his movies, that David Lean is the greatest British director ever, with exception of Hitchc0ck.
In just these four movies he excells in so many different Genres
and aspects.
I actualy think this is my favorte out of the four, with the very close runner ups of 'Bridge Over river Kwai' and 'Lawrence of Arabia'. I didn't particulaly like 'Dr. Zhivago'.

I thought the kid was fantastic. Probably the best acting by a child that I've ever seen.

I was shocked to see such a young Alec Guiness. He was only 31, and had blond hair!
He looks at least 25 years older in 'The Bridge over river Kwai', which was only a decade later.

I can't think of anything else, but this movie is one of the adaptations I've ever seen.
9/10
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Post by fable »

Paul Scofield gives one of the best preformances ever by an actor as Sir Thomas Moore, the Catholic priest who was executed for not agreeing to devorce King Henry VIII.

Minor correction: Thomas Moore wasn't a priest. He was Henry's Chancellor, and as such, had to provide his sanction to Henry's wish to divorce one of his wives. Moore had been perfectly willing to go along with all of Henry's other high-handed actions, and certainly indulged in quite a few of his own. However, he seems to have felt that the RCC was bigger than Henry, better to side with, and would rescue him. In this, he was wrong. All he got for his troubles was a saint's halo after his death. ;)
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Post by Morlock »

I saw yesterday K19: The Widowmaker.

I can't say I was disaponted, as I wasn't expecting anything good, but it really had nothing good about it.

It basicaly combines 'Das Boot', 'The hunt for red October', 'Crimson Tide', and 'U-571' into one movie.
By trying to avoid cliche', the movie, instead of being original, was just plain dull.

Neither Ford nor Neesan were particulaly good.

A waste of time IMO.
5/10
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Post by Tamerlane »

The Russian widows weren't exactly impressed by its interpretation also. A bit like Pearl Harbor, heavy on the action (haven't seen the movie, just speculation) and very little based on fact.
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Post by The Z »

U-571 wasn't based on fact either. The English got the Enigma (that's what it was called right?)....not the Americans.

PS: Watched Zoolander....probably the worst movie I've seen with Ben Stiller in it.....
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Post by Tybaltus »

You know, if you guys want to find out what critics have to say about every movie that has come out since 1994 or 1995, go to the site http://www.rottentomatoes.com I go there all the time. They preview each movie thats coming out this week, and while I dont let the critics tell me what to think, I want to hear their opinions. Many times they are usually right. I also love to go to the site to hear many of them bash bad movies witht their reviews. It can get very comical.
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