Natuk: Indie game

[Gilliatt]

I found this game yesterday (thanks to IceStorm9999) and played the demo for about 5 hours.

Tom Proudfoot's Games

I think it may interest those of you who like indie games. Not much story or role-playing here, it's more a dungeon crawler with turned-based combat. From what I read, the combat is similar to the one in Wizard's Crown and Eternal Dagger (two games I haven't played, so I can't comment on that). It took me some time before enjoying it, but after completing two dungeons, I decided to buy it. Although it's repetitive (fights, fights, and fights), the variety of skills and the character improvement make it interesting IMO. And it can be fun to play some nasty orcs!

Don't expect a masterpiece though, this is no Planescape Torment.

The demo is free, so you don't have much to loose if you think this could be your type of game.

[Gilliatt]

I would like to point out that I have not received any confirmation from the developer since I bought the game.

Maybe he considers the Paypal confirmation is enough, and maybe the CD is already in the mail, but since the other Indie developers I bought from so far all sent me official confirmations, it makes me wonder if Tom Proudfoot is still doing business.

If you are interested in buying the game, I suggest you wait a little, I'll keep you updated.

[Gilliatt]

Here is an update (if someone is interested).

Mr. Tom Proudfoot is still doing business: I received my Natuk CD today. The reason it took so long is because Paypal did not sent my purchase confirmation to him, so he learned about it only when I sent him an email to ask why it was taking so long.

After I sent my email, I was very satisfied with his service, and shipping was fast.

[Lykurgos]

Hi Gilliatt,

Is this one of the games that is part of your play-list before you move onto the Buck Rogers games?

I'm thinking about picking this up myself, and would like to ask you if you'd recommend it after having received the CD?

For reference, I really enjoyed playing an old game called Disciples of Steel. It received terrible press and the only place I have ever seen appreciation expressed for it is Abandonia. I got hooked on it because:

1. The turn-based combat allowed for location based aiming (head, arms, legs etc) and damage (arrow through the eye, decapitation, bruised ribs, broken arm etc)
2. Trolls & Ogres were amongst the playable races, I always took a Troll Figher and an Ogre Blacksmith
3. The breadth of the enemy forces and the power-growth of your party in game was quite amazing, more so than anything I've experienced before or since.
4. There was a strategy game built into the RPG, which involved turn-based combat between large units. Your party could raise its own personnel army, if it had enough gold.

[Gilliatt]

Well, there will be at least one indie game on that list, but I'm not sure if it's going to be Natuk or Teudogar.

I have played the Natuk demo, but have not continued since I received the CD. To be honest, that's a game I hesitated before purchasing. As mentioned in my first post, story is minimal: it's a dungeon crawler with lots of fights. So I was afraid it would become very repetitive. I finally decided to buy it since I was having fun.

I have not played Disciples of Steel, so I can't compare the two games, sorry.

One interesting feature of Natuk is that you have an 8 characters party, so it's fun for diversity. But I read somewhere that you end up improving only two stats, so diversity is pretty gone (because experience gains are based on intelligence and spellcasters use strength to cast spells). That said, I don't know if that person was a powergamer of if he was saying it's the only successfull way. Personally, I did not go that way when I played the demo, but I didn't got far enough either to see if I was making good or a bad decisions.

I have tried many demos since I tried the Natuk one, so I can't really remember the details. I don't remember if there were aimed shots for example, but I do remember that you could bleed and loose points each round for that, and I also think there were crippled limbs. (If I recall correctly you could loose an eye and have a permanent stat lost as a result.)

All I can really suggest is that you try the demo yourself and see if you like it. I'm sorry, but I can't be more precise. One reason for this is that I tend to approach demos differently than full games, since I play them when I don't have much spare time. I play them mostly to see if I am having fun and if I would like to continue with the full game, I don't tend to explore all the possibilities the game can offer.

[Lykurgos]

No worries, thanks for the reply. I've downloaded the demo too. I played but for a very short time only, and found that in combat the mouse scrolling is so fast as to make it impossible to navigate around the combat area. I'm sure that can be solved though, and will get back to it soon.

[Gilliatt]

Now that you mention it, I remember the mouse scrolling problem. Unfortunately, I don't remember if I was able to fix it. If I recall correctly though, there was a key that enables you to center the view on your characters, so you could get back to them if you scrolled too far.

[Gilliatt]

I have decided to play the game, you tempted me when you talked about it, Lykurgos. To solve the mouse problem, go to the Preference Menu and change the scroll delay.

Investing all my XP in Intelligence did not turn out a good idea. I had to restart the game from scratch once I reached the Hobgoblin cave.

[Lykurgos]

Aha, you are playing, my plan worked, terrific

So, how do you rate the tactical combat Gilliatt? Throw some comparisons at me if you have the time.

[Gilliatt]

Sorry if I'm delaying my reply. I have not played as much as I wanted to and I want to hold my judgment until I get farther in game.

[Gilliatt]

Ok, I think I have completed about 40-45% of the game, so I’ll give a few comments on my appreciation so far.

To be honest, I’m rather disappointed for now. It may change in later parts, but since the beginning it has been a very repetitive game. I’d say it’s definitely a “try before you buy” game. It’s really not for everyone since story, choice & consequence, NPC interactions and quests are minimal if non-existent.

I found only one really important “strategy” (if you can call it that). Unfortunately, it has nothing to do with the choices you make during combat, it actually occurs before combat starts. Here’s what it’s about. Since you are outnumbered in almost every fight, you just can’t afford being surrounded or else your whole party will die quickly. So you have to create a wall with your fighters in order to prevent the enemies from reaching and hitting your spell casters. This is done automatically most of the time since many combats happen in narrow passages. When fighting in an open area, you have to find a good spot (sometimes by trial and error) so you can deploy this formation before too much damage has been done.

I would say that this positioning is about 90% of your strategy. The other 10% (using the chanting skill, buffing and healing fighters, casting confusion spells to see enemies fight each other, using aimed attacks, etc.) does offer some options, but it doesn’t really have a big impact on the outcome of the fight. I can’t say that healing your characters before they fall, or casting an armor spell on them when facing strong enemies, or using the turn undead spell against undead enemies are elaborate strategies. I find them pretty intuitive and don’t think they add to the fun or make the game original. Moreover, I have not found strong offensive spells so far (except turn undead), so there has not really been an interesting alternative between offensive or defensive spells for my spell casters. Since the beginning, I only had one memorable fight where I needed to think about more strategy than this. That’s less than 1%, so it’s nothing to write home about. And since this game is all about fighting, I find this emphasis on positioning disappointing.

I’m tempted to say that Natuk looks better on paper than it is in reality. It may offer 30 + skills, but so far I have invested all my XP in only two skills for my spell casters and their magic is not overpowered at all. I don’t want to imagine how weak they would be if I had invested points elsewhere.

Of course, your appreciation of the game will depend on how much repetition you can take. Personally, I could barely finish the first Diablo game because I found it too repetitive, while some people might have played it 20 + times. So I guess the type of games you enjoy will determine if you like Natuk or not.

So I’ll repeat what I already said, try the demo and see if you still want more after it (the demo is about 1/3 of the game). I have not given up on the game, but for now, I can’t take more than 2 or 3 hours of Natuk a day before I get bored. That said, I don’t regret my purchase since I’ve put many hours into it and I really had fun in the beginning. So even though I’m rather disappointed now, I believe that I have played enough for the 17$ the game cost me.

[Gilliatt]

Well, I finally finished Natuk, so I thought I could put some comments if anyone is interested.

My opinion as not changed much since my last post. This game is all about combat. I believe there are less than 10 quests in the whole game. There is no NPC interaction, no interesting dialogue, no interesting story: only interesting combat. Character development is not really interesting either: investing in magic cost so much that you need to invest about 90% of your skill points into it to be able to cast the most powerfull spells. So the game gets very repetitive. I imagine some people can find it fun to experiment different tactics in combat, but I am the kind of person who sticks to the same strategy when I find one that is effective. For that reason, I was never really interested in trying 10 different spells on each enemy so I could find out which one was the most effective against each type of monster.

If you are a combat lover and the perspective of 50 hours of somewhat strategic turn-based combat without story, quest or dialogue looks fun to you, then you might enjoy Natuk. If, like me, you love diversity I do not recommend this game. Personally, I needed two big breaks away from the game before I could complete it because I got bored at some point. I even lowered the difficulty to 50% in the final castle because I just wanted to get it over with as fast as possible.

[SkeleTony]

First off, though I assume you discovered this already I will mention for others here that Natuk DOES feature tactical considerations such as aiming for specific body parts, attacking with two weapons vs. attack + parry vs. attacking to stun/drain strength instead of HP, etc.

Secondly, you are correct that there are not many actual quests in the game and if you are one of those who feels Planescape torment is a good RPG then you probably won't like Natuk. Natuk is an unapologetic tactical RPG. Also while most of the direct damage type spells are useless (at the very least until you can cast "Soul Wind" and such), there are several far more useful spells such as "Fumble", "Charm", etc. The game's mechanics are quite broken though as far as the spells draining 'Strength' (where Strength is both an indicator of physical size as well as vitality/vigor, which makes no sense really) and yes typically because of this broken mechanic all classes tend to raise Intelligence first, then Strength, then Health or Dexterity, then Willpower, etc.

But where the game shines is in the plot (which you derided) and humor as well as the combat. How many games start you off as a party of eight orcs, half-trolls and ogres who have betrayed the emperor and been sentenced to death but end up in a slave mine killing rats due to a bureaucratic error? And the ending is something I have never seen done in any other RPG ever made! ( I won't spoil it here)