some wizard questions/suggestions

[llmercll]

few questions

1 - am i forced to travel with a party throughout the game?

2 - i was considering going 18wiz/1PM/1SD, so i can fireball/hide in plan sight/fireball/hide. anyone have any suggestions or experience with that build? would i get the situation to ever use it (which goes back to my first questions)

3 - does anyone know how spells a day are affected by int? the more int the more spells but exactly how many? is taking the necromancy specialization (the best one, correct me if im wrong) worth it?

I thought the fireball/hide combo seemed pretty cool. i would only lose 1 caster level for some great survivability and what seems to me like fun. but if ive got a big party with me all the time that tanks for me, there'd be little point to wasting the caster level for hide if i were to rarely use it.

[GawainBS]

Playing with a party is highly recommended, since the NPCs give you extra quests and interactions.

[Loki[D.d.G]]

Not to mention playing with a party will avoid getting your main character slaughtered all the time. A full wiz, can be pretty weak, and hide is by no means a sure fire way of remaining unseen. Once you finish a conversation with hostile npcs, your character will be left vulnerable to any disables, or damaging spells they throw at you.

[baron667]

besides, a fb is not that great.

good for backing up a meleer party member, but won't win all fights by itself, no matter how many one might throw.

it could have worked in bg1, but dnd has progressed quite a bit from that period.

[Scottg]

few questions

1 - am i forced to travel with a party throughout the game?

2 - i was considering going 18wiz/1PM/1SD, so i can fireball/hide in plan sight/fireball/hide. anyone have any suggestions or experience with that build? would i get the situation to ever use it (which goes back to my first questions)

3 - does anyone know how spells a day are affected by int? the more int the more spells but exactly how many? is taking the necromancy specialization (the best one, correct me if im wrong) worth it?

I thought the fireball/hide combo seemed pretty cool. i would only lose 1 caster level for some great survivability and what seems to me like fun. but if ive got a big party with me all the time that tanks for me, there'd be little point to wasting the caster level for hide if i were to rarely use it.

1 - No. You *can* forgo them all, EXCEPT for the final battle, potentially a few quests (a certain female character particularly), and possibly the Keep's "wall battle". This doesn't mean that you should remove them however. Note that you can put each of them on "puppet mode" (in the character sheet right-most tab), then right click on your character and issue the command "stand your ground". THAT would leave them to stay in that one place until you give the command "follow me". This basically allows you to Solo the game except for those canned fights that start with dialogue between you and the opponent. Note that there are reasons for gaining "favor" with companions beyond their potential quests.

2 - It's a good build. Make sure you choose the feat Able Learner to be able to keep placing points in Hide and Move Silently without a penalty. The problem with Fireball in particular is that it's an area effect and can often ruin chests (and potentially ruin the contents). It's also a reflex-save spell where many of the opponents are reflex-Save types *with* Improved Evasion. The Missile Storms are better (in this respect) and have no Save.

3 - Ability modifier - NWN2Wiki, the Neverwinter Nights 2 wiki - Races, classes, skills, and more The Necromancy feats are good for overcoming fortitude saves from opponents when using Necromancy spells. They each give you +1. Note that a +1 Intelligence *modifier* gives you the same benefit (to all your spells) - this makes the level 1 feat Spell Casting Prodigy particularly worthwhile. In combination (Intelligence Modifiers + Spell Level + feat "Focuses" like Necromancy), can potentially make Necromancy spells work far more often (..6th level Circle of Death in particular).

4 - Make sure by level 12-15 (when you have quite a bit of cash to spend), that you select the feat Craft Wand. There are several areas where you will run-out of offensive spells, and several Fireball and Issac's Lesser Missile Storm wands can make an impossible "Solo" gaming experience easy by comparison. I should also point out that the feat Spell Casting Prodigy at level 1 should be chosen as well. Look to the Strongheart Hafling with an 18 Int. and an 18 Dex..

[llmercll]

1 - No. You *can* forgo them all, EXCEPT for the final battle, potentially a few quests (a certain female character particularly), and possibly the Keep's "wall battle". This doesn't mean that you should remove them however. Note that you can put each of them on "puppet mode" (in the character sheet right-most tab), then right click on your character and issue the command "stand your ground". THAT would leave them to stay in that one place until you give the command "follow me". This basically allows you to Solo the game except for those canned fights that start with dialogue between you and the opponent. Note that there are reasons for gaining "favor" with companions beyond their potential quests.

2 - It's a good build. Make sure you choose the feat Able Learner to be able to keep placing points in Hide and Move Silently without a penalty. The problem with Fireball in particular is that it's an area effect and can often ruin chests (and potentially ruin the contents). It's also a reflex-save spell where many of the opponents are reflex-Save types *with* Improved Evasion. The Missile Storms are better (in this respect) and have no Save.

3 - Ability modifier - NWN2Wiki, the Neverwinter Nights 2 wiki - Races, classes, skills, and more The Necromancy feats are good for overcoming fortitude saves from opponents when using Necromancy spells. They each give you +1. Note that a +1 Intelligence *modifier* gives you the same benefit (to all your spells) - this makes the level 1 feat Spell Casting Prodigy particularly worthwhile. In combination (Intelligence Modifiers + Spell Level + feat "Focuses" like Necromancy), can potentially make Necromancy spells work far more often (..6th level Circle of Death in particular).

4 - Make sure by level 12-15 (when you have quite a bit of cash to spend), that you select the feat Craft Wand. There are several areas where you will run-out of offensive spells, and several Fireball and Issac's Lesser Missile Storm wands can make an impossible "Solo" gaming experience easy by comparison. I should also point out that the feat Spell Casting Prodigy at level 1 should be chosen as well. Look to the Strongheart Hafling with an 18 Int. and an 18 Dex..

thanks for that post, answered all my questions =)

like others said though, I think my first time thru I will play with a party...maybe just so i don't feel lonely running through caves lol. and that was I can focus on my wizard and wizard only.

So, I have both the exp and the OC. If i install them both can i make my character into an arcane candle during the OC? or would i still need to wait? and when i start the exp do i import my character from the OC or start at 1 again?

Arcane scholars look pretty good. if im not mistaken, there is NO disadvantage to taking this once it's available...bonuses to class skills, a ton of extra feats, etc

im not too sure about red wixzards...pale masters are always good for 1 level though becuase of the hp and defense bonuses (aghain, correct me if im wrong)

heres a build im looking at now

==========================================================


1. Nuke-o-matic [VIB1]
(Human Wizard/Arcane Scholar/Red Wizard/Pale Master)

A caster that focuses on casting spells that directly damage the enemy.
With metamagic feats, spells of any level can be fireballs. Be sure to
pick up Mirror Image, Improved Invisibility, and any other Illusion
spells you might want before switching to Red Wizard. Note that the
character has to be non-good.

STR 8
DEX 14
CON 16
INT 18
WIS 8
CHA 8

(If level 20 is the stop point, put the level 20 stat point into
constitution)

Key skills:
Concentration, Spellcraft

Feats and stats by level:
Wiz1: (Evocation focus), Spellcasting Prodigy, Skill Focus: Concentration
Wiz2:
Wiz3: Skill Focus: Spellcraft
Wiz4: +1 INT
Wiz5: (Empower Spell)
Wiz5ArS1: (Maximize Spell), Spell Penetration
Wiz5ArS2:
Wiz5ArS3: +1INT, (Improved Empower)
Wiz5ArS4: Greater Spell Penetration
Wiz5ArS4RdW1:
Wiz5ArS4RdW2:
Wiz5ArS4RdW3: +1 INT, Spell Focus: Evocation
Wiz5ArS4RdW4:
Wiz5ArS4RdW5:
Wiz5ArS4RdW6: Greater Spell Focus: Evocation
Wiz5ArS4RdW7: +1 INT
Wiz5ArS4RdW8:
Wiz5ArS4RdW9: Toughness
Wiz5ArS4RdW10:
Wiz5ArS4RdW10PlM1: +1 INT


would this build take a big EXP hit? is the 1 in pale master even worth it because of the exp loss? It's right from a guide on gamefaqs and the guy seems to know what hes doing...idk

in mask the betrayer i could probably continue with the wizard or arcane scholar then i take it

[GawainBS]

You never gain an XP hit for Prestige Classes.

[Scottg]

thanks for that post, answered all my questions =)

like others said though, I think my first time thru I will play with a party...maybe just so i don't feel lonely running through caves lol. and that was I can focus on my wizard and wizard only.


..would this build take a big EXP hit? is the 1 in pale master even worth it because of the exp loss? It's right from a guide on gamefaqs and the guy seems to know what hes doing...idk

in mask the betrayer i could probably continue with the wizard or arcane scholar then i take it

Your welcome!

Good idea to use companions.

DO ***NOT*** start with a Red Wizard build. It is easily the most difficult class/build to configure and play.

In general use a "generalist" Wizard (..which the Red Wizard cannot be). Generalist Wizards have access to ALL spells, where specialized Wizards do not. Access to all spells allows you to target specific opponents with spells that they do not have Saves for. THIS is a critical feature.

If you want a PM/Arcane Scholar of Candlekeep then I'd suggest this build:

Ascendant | NWN2 Character Builder

To the best of my knowledge the spell Silence isn't a problem in the OC or MOTB, so you could always make some alterations (level 18 for the OC).

For instance at level 18 feat: Spell Focus Necromancy.
..and at level 19: Greater Spell Focus Necromancy.

At epic levels for MOTB I'd probably look to Great Intelligence feats instead of the "Auto Silent Spell" feats.

DO NOT USE A RACE WITH A LEVEL PENALTY FOR THE OC (..for a Wizard build). At least not on your first game.

As GawainBS mentioned, no XP loss for *any* prestige class.

[Sain]

No Eldritch Knight? A Wiz/Sorc-Eld Knight can be a force to be feared(maybe, I'm only at Old Owl Well with mine) An Eldritch Knight has a very nice Chain Shirt that you get in Neverwinter, that can be worn without an ASF. That with an ASF free Mithril Heavy Shield, you will become a very nice spell caster(given taking a very of fighter is reconmended, but it will mean that you don't get level 9 spell untill level 19)

[GawainBS]

No Eldritch Knight? A Wiz/Sorc-Eld Knight can be a force to be feared(maybe, I'm only at Old Owl Well with mine) An Eldritch Knight has a very nice Chain Shirt that you get in Neverwinter, that can be worn without an ASF. That with an ASF free Mithril Heavy Shield, you will become a very nice spell caster(given taking a very of fighter is reconmended, but it will mean that you don't get level 9 spell untill level 19)

Personally, I'd don't want to lose any caster levels, unless I would go for a true Fighter/Mage.

[Sain]

Personally, I'd don't want to lose any caster levels, unless I would go for a true Fighter/Mage.

Isn't having to wait one more level to cast any given spell worth the EK chain and 5 BAB?

[GawainBS]

Isn't having to wait one more level to cast any given spell worth the EK chain and 5 BAB?

If I want to be a Fighter/Mage, then yes.

If I want to be a Wizard and thus not get into melee, no.

[Scottg]

No Eldritch Knight? A Wiz/Sorc-Eld Knight can be a force to be feared(maybe, I'm only at Old Owl Well with mine) An Eldritch Knight has a very nice Chain Shirt that you get in Neverwinter, that can be worn without an ASF. That with an ASF free Mithril Heavy Shield, you will become a very nice spell caster(given taking a very of fighter is reconmended, but it will mean that you don't get level 9 spell untill level 19)

An EK build is a bit different than a purist Wizard. Note that you can achieve a purist Wizard via the use of the feat Practiced Spell Caster Wizard, but the penalty will be additional feats - feats that can be exceedingly important to a purist Wizard.

EK's are good for:

1. Improving BAB for: Tenser's, Melee Touch Attack, Ranged Touch Attack, Spell Sword characters, and
2. Improving Fortitude Saves.

None of which is terribly necessary for a good purist Wizard build.

A good purist Wizard should "motor around" pretty much invisible, and when finding an opponent assessing their "save-type" and whipping-out an appropriate wand to fire at the opponent from as safe a distance as possible. If wands won't work then you need to look to your well-stocked spell-book. Melee (even touch attack) should generally be a "last-ditch" effort to pound your opponent.

[llmercll]

OK so I've decided to go pure caster. I don't want to specialize, so I'll be going generalist wizard.

here is what im thinking

1 in pale master, since there are no drawbacks but +2 ac

10 in ASoC becuase they have nice bonuses and skills

and then 19? in wizard...I'd be missing out on a feat. not sure if its worth going 20 wizard and skipping on the pale master though.

so does 1PM/19Wiz/10ASoC or 20Wiz/10ASoC sound good? again, i don't want to be the red wizard because of the specialization, id rather just collect all the spells =p


and for the ASoC metamagic feat changers, do i need for example, empower spell to get the improved empower spell feat? and if i do need it, can i still put an empowered spell two slots higher AND 1 slot higher? making for some sick customizing =p






After looking at it, it might be wise to just have a level 30 wizard in the end... I found this on game banshee

===============================================
Epic Level Benefits [MotB Only]

· New feats are gained every other level instead of every third level (levels 21, 23, 25, 27, 29). These feats are in addition to the bonus feats for specific classes.

· Ability score improvements continue every 4 levels (levels 24, 28).

· Base Attack Bonus and Base Saves continue as normal.

· Additional attacks per round with every 5 points of Base Attack Bonus, unlike in tabletop D&D where the base number of attacks is capped at 4.

· +1 DC to all spells every third epic level (23, 26, 29).

· Caster level = class level.

· The sorcerer or wizard’s familiar continues to improve: 21-22 +11 Natural armor
23-24 +12 Natural armor
25-26 +13 Natural armor
27-28 +14 Natural armor
29-30 +15 Natural armor

· +1 feat at levels 23, 26, and 29 (every 3 levels).
===============================================

I don't see any of those bonuses for the ASoC, just the special feats, really. those, 5 special feats Vs. 8 feats, +3DC...hmm I'm thinking pure wizard now. Unless the feats offered by the ASoC are far superior than anything I could need at level 20

[Scottg]

1st lets look at it from a negative point of view:

What do you loose?

Palemaster 1 level: You loose one or two feats. (..the second feat from the expenditure in Able Learner.)

Arcane Scholar 1-10 levels: You effectively loose three to four feats. (..Spellcraft and Concentration feats are considered "losses", the fourth feat lost is if you go more than 5 levels.)

Note however that IF you combine the two AND keep the Arcane Scholar class to 4 or fewer levels then you effectively "gain-back" a feat. The net result for a Palemaster of one level AND an Arcane Scholar of 3-4 levels equals a loss of 3 feats (or 4 feats if you include Able Learner). IMO you loose 4 feats this route.



What do you gain?

Palemaster: Defense (Stealth and a modest AC improvement), and Additional skills, particularly dialogue skills. IMO if you don't have Able Learner then this class is worthless. The addition of AC doesn't really mean much, but the skills mean a LOT. Stealth in particular is incredibly powerful, especially considering that Invisibility has recently been "gimped" (depending on what game-build you have).

Arcane Scholar: For 3 levels you gain Improved Empower Spell - an excellent feat, particularly for an Empowered Horrid Wilting. At 10 levels you gain Improved Quicken - an excellent feat for rare occasions when you need to either put up a strong defense quickly like Ethereal Visage or you need to quickly disable one opponent via Bigby's Forceful Hand. For the most part Improved Maximize isn't better than Improved Empower.



What's worth it?

In combination both are good, but they (should) end-up costing 4 feats.

..otherwise:

That single level of Palemaster + Able Learner is *exceedingly* worthwhile IMO. IF invisibility wasn't quite as "broken" as it is, then it would be less worthwhile, but still very good.

Arcane Scholar's Improved Empower is nice, but not critical.

If you are going to cut a class here then Arcane Scholar is the one to cut. Note that with Empower Spell you'll still get to utilize Empowered spells, you just won't be able to Empower 8th level spells (like Horrid Wilting). IMO that isn't a deal-breaker, but the lack of Stealth and other skills would be.

I should also add that it *can* be good to have your 6th level spells Empowered spells at 8th level instead of 7th level (as it would with Improved Empower Spell). The reason:

6th level: Circle of Death OR Issac's Greater Missile Storm are BOTH excellent spells for "empowering".

(..note that on testing, Circle of Death does seem to benefit (effect more kills) from "empowering" with more recent game-builds.. I'm not however 100% sure of this, so a caveat is in order.)

IF you have Improved Empower Spell, then when empowered they take up 7th level spell slots. There are unfortunately *two* excellent offensive spells at 7th level that can't be empowered - Avasculate and Bigby's Forceful Hand. IF you want to empower either of those 6th level spells then you will necessarily loose several slots for Bigby's Forceful hand and Avasculate.

IF however you DO NOT HAVE Improved Empower Spell, then those 6th levels spells will occupy one spell level higher when empowered - i.e. *8th* level spells. Beyond Premonition and Ethereal Jaunt, there aren't *really* important spells here, and certainly not *offensive* spells. (Horrid Wilting is good non-empowered, but not *really* good - it only averages about 65 damage per opponent max.)

(Note however that you can partially get "around" this limitation by *extending* Bigby's Forceful Hand which "pushes" it up one spell level higher to 8th level spells.)

So excepting empowered Horrid Wilting, it *may* be a good thing to NOT have Improved Empower Spell.

So if you cut the Arcane Scholar then you should end up with 2 fewer feats, which isn't to bad and offers a LOT in return.

[Scottg]

I don't see any of those bonuses for the ASoC, just the special feats, really. those, 5 special feats Vs. 8 feats, +3DC...hmm I'm thinking pure wizard now. Unless the feats offered by the ASoC are far superior than anything I could need at level 20

Feat-wise it's the same EXCEPT for the additional bonus every 5 levels for the Wizard class. I *think* it's even the same for the familiar (..but it might not be), not that it was really important anyway.

One critical thing that isn't apparent.

Feats are better at Epic levels, so the more feats you have to select at epic levels - the better your build. (..particularly for the "Great Intelligence" feats.)

For the Wizard class this means you are *generally* better-off "front-loading" your prestige classes so you get as many of your Wizard class bonus feats at those epic levels as possible.

[llmercll]

Thanks scott you've been really helpful. few more questions though =p

why do skills affect the invisibility spell? is it hide?

If I have 10 ASoC and 10 WIZ, effectively making me level 20, would any further wizard levels be considered epic? Is it class level that needs to be 20+ or character level? If it's character level than awesome!!!

[GawainBS]

Character level.

[Scottg]

Thanks scott you've been really helpful. few more questions though =p

why do skills affect the invisibility spell? is it hide?

If I have 10 ASoC and 10 WIZ, effectively making me level 20, would any further wizard levels be considered epic? Is it class level that needs to be 20+ or character level? If it's character level than awesome!!!

Again, your welcome!

Invisibility:

With the more recent builds it seems that many opponents are far more "perceptive" than they should be. Perhaps its a sniff/listen thing more than a spot thing, and Invisibility really doesn't help much against either sniff or listen. Of course IF you are standing still then listen itself should not be a detriment either, but I'd swear that even standing still against non-sniff opponents that you are still *to* easily located when just Invisible. Worse, it doesn't seem that you can "recover" from being located while moving and then stopping. Ex. - say you are only located when moving, so you decide to stop so that your opponent(s) can't listen for you. Unfortunately however they are often still able to locate you.

Additionally it now seems that you are required to enter Stealth mode via the "hide" button to get your Move Silently skill to work. Before that wasn't the case - it was automatic.

This doesn't mean that Invisibility does not have its uses, (50% concealment is fantastic and you are still non-target-able for direct spells unless the opponent has a "see invisibility" type spell active), it's just that it's a LOT less useful than it once was and really requires a decent stealth character to make the most of it. Principally this means that you need a very good Move Silently skill and a decent Hide skill, and of course that's IF you decide to move after casting Invisibility - then you click on the "stealth" button.


Class/Character Levels: (..oops Gawain beat me to it.)

1st: The OC will not allow you to achieve more than 20 levels, it's a "hard cap". You can however continue-on with this character for MOTB IF you save the character right before the game ends.

2nd: Epic levels are based on Character levels. Once you hit character level 21 you are "Epic". If you had 10Wis/10ASoCK for your first 20 levels and then added another 10 Wizard levels then those final 10 would all be Epic.

[llmercll]

That's awesome! I thought you needed to have a 21 Wiz to get epic benefits to kind of balance with the prestige classes.

And About the invisibility...the defense bonuses are still there, but the actually hide effect is whats bugged? if thats the case I don't care as much since I only really used it for the defense bonus from 50% concealment.

OK, so let me get this straight...



Epic Level Benefits [MotB Only]

· New feats are gained every other level instead of every third level (levels 21, 23, 25, 27, 29). These feats are in addition to the bonus feats for specific classes.

· Ability score improvements continue every 4 levels (levels 24, 28).

· Base Attack Bonus and Base Saves continue as normal.

· Additional attacks per round with every 5 points of Base Attack Bonus, unlike in tabletop D&D where the base number of attacks is capped at 4.

· +1 DC to all spells every third epic level (23, 26, 29).

· Caster level = class level.

· The sorcerer or wizard’s familiar continues to improve: 21-22 +11 Natural armor
23-24 +12 Natural armor
25-26 +13 Natural armor
27-28 +14 Natural armor
29-30 +15 Natural armor

· +1 feat at levels 23, 26, and 29 (every 3 levels).



I'll get those bonuses at the character elvel, regardless of the class im leveling up? I'm unsure of how feats work. once every third level until level 20 then every second level? and in order to get the +1 feat at level 23 would I need to level up my wizard class when I'm character level 23? does the same go for the +1DC? would I need to level up the wizard on that level to get the bonus?