Dual Classing is THE most powerful way to go...period

ArmageddonUnlimited · Post by **ArmageddonUnlimited** » Thu Dec 06, 2001 7:52 am

Just letting anyone know who hasn't yet realised, if you playing with the XP Cap on, no party of equal XP can compare with the sheer power of an all dual-classed party. Multi-classes are too expensive beyond level 10(ish) and cannot compete with an equal XP dual classed character. Generally, level 9/10 is the way to go because you get your full hp that way. An amazingly powered party (comparative XP-wise) for example is:
1)Kensai dualed to Mage
2)Wizard Slayer dualed to Thief
3)Beserker dualed to Priest
4)Invoker dualed to Priest (at level 12)
5)Priest (Talos) dualed to Mage (at level 12)
6)Sorcerer (or Monk or Barbarian depending on which edge you wanna go with)

Do the math with the XP and then look at the thaco's, hp's and power options (5 full level casters) and this cannot be debated! Of course, it works best if you use the right spell combo's for the right classes i.e. The Kensai/Mage is unstoppable with Tensors Transformation alone! But add in mirror image, stoneskin, improved invisibility, improved haste and he's unbelievable - at higher levels, include things like Spell trap and Black Blades of Disaster and the dude can take anything or any group in the game.

Also note that fighters who dual class can still continue to specialise wih the fighter limitations at higher levels (bug persistant even after the patch). Thus even though he is now advancing as a priest (for example) he can continue to get those 5 specialisation stars in each of his primary weapons as well as 3 in Two-Handed specialisation. Despite having stopped training as a fighter at level 10, the character will still have a thaco well below zero all for a cost equal to one lousy level if he was single classed. Nuff said...

Kovi · Post by **Kovi** » Thu Dec 06, 2001 9:37 am

Yes, that is the way to go in SoA. But if you plan to play ToB with no xpcap or small party or solo multiclasses are comparable, because of the high level ability rules.
A low level (9-12) dual will miss the high level abilites of the first class and the thac0/saves cap anyway. A high level (>20) dual is a strong character, but needs a long transition period.

[ 12-06-2001: Message edited by: Kovi ]

Silvanerian · Post by **Silvanerian** » Thu Dec 06, 2001 9:48 am

Yes, I agree with Kovi.
If you think that dual-classes are great, you should definitely try out a multi-class in ToB. THEY rule.
Besides, at very high levels it doesn't really do much, imo, if you're a dual F9/mage25 (or above) or just a plain mage. The differences are very small - "only" around 30 HP - which is good for a mage, I agree, 3 better in THAC0 and an extra attack.
The only thing I can see that might come in handy is the HPs - as I never use my mages as fighters anyway.
But a multiclass f20/m20? Oh, boy - is he able to kick ass!

-Sylvanerian

bbbrisco · Post by **bbbrisco** » Thu Dec 06, 2001 1:53 pm

Exactly - the party given above would have their butts kicked all over by multi's with a nice collection of GW's etc. Multi's are much better in ToB, despite the added power of some of the kits, mainly because the fighter special abilities are so useful.

Bruce Lee · Post by **Bruce Lee** » Thu Dec 06, 2001 3:10 pm

A much better party (powerwise) would be:
Gnome fighter/illusionist
Halfing fighter/thief
Half-elven ranger/cleric
Elven Sorceror.

The party you are suggesting will have 5 classes that haven't reactivated the first class at on stage which must be a pain.
I really don't like dualclassing so maybe mu opinion isn't very objective. Anyway I think multiclass is much better.

koz-ivan · Post by **koz-ivan** » Thu Dec 06, 2001 9:45 pm

casting a vote for multi class.

elf: ftr/thief

really like this class, high dex, bonus w/ long swords & bows. greater whirlwind, traps, use any item. what's not to like?

ReignsOfPower · Post by **ReignsOfPower** » Thu Dec 06, 2001 11:22 pm

I agree otherwise. I think dual class is a much more potent character configuration. By the time a multi classed Fighter/Mage, for example, hits level 20/20 the Dual classed one would reach 8/28 for example. Summing it up, the class that you dual to will always be better than a multi-classes one. i.e. The mage side of the Dual would be stronger than the Multi-classed. The idea of a dual is to have a kind of 'backup' to your new class, not to be good in both. If you want to be goodish in both, ofcourse go multi! Only big problem with Multi being it takes to long to gain a level since your exp is shared b/w 2 or 3 classes. When I played Fighter/mage multi it took a day of playing to grow in both classes level!

Tirinal · Post by **Tirinal** » Sat Dec 08, 2001 11:35 pm

While we're on the subject of dual-classing, I have an (incredibly) newbie-ish question. What is the exact number for the exp cap? I can't find it anywhere on the web, and I don't have the manual (lost it:mad

. I'm thinking of making a kensai/mage (stoneskin, tenser's transformation, able to wear actual armor), and I need to know at what lvl to try dual classing. Thanks!

Zelgadis · Post by **Zelgadis** » Sat Dec 08, 2001 11:57 pm

2.75 or 2.95 million for soa, i think, and 8 million for tob

I recomend dual classing a kensai at lvl 13, because you get an extra 1/2 attack per round over lvl 12, +4 to attack and to hit, 3 kai abilities, and -3 to speed

[ 12-09-2001: Message edited by: Zelgadis ]

Amidala · Post by **Amidala** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 1:18 pm

ReignsOfPower,
since there is no spell progression beyond level 20 the usefullness of a 9/39 char is limited, though Turn Undead etc is nice.