Kensai/Mage... How to use himr?

[Alson]

OK guys, i need some help...
I have a Kensai/Mage as my main char. He dualed at level 13, and he just reached level 14 as a mage (Boy, did he read alot of scrolls! ). He leads a party of six.
It's my first time as a Kensai/Mage, and i want some tips on how to use him...
Some info:
He has 3 *'s in Dual-Wielding, and 5 *'s in Katanas. For me, Katanas are a must for any Kensai!
ToB insatalled, and, more important, Sola mod is installed, so you know what Katana i'm after... .
He won't use the robe of Vecna... The robe is for Kelsey.

So i need some ideas...
1) I love interesting Contigencies, Sequencers and Triggers... Any suggestions? espcially on Contigencies....
2) Any suggestions on equipment? I already mentioned Katanas... what robe should i wear?
3) Spells that i should memorize? I already have a Sorc and a Blade, so most of my spells will be self-buffing....Kelsey is wearing Vecna, so i prefer quick spells....
4) Should i use Tenser in only in big fights?

Any other tips are welcomed.

@Littiz - any words of wisdom from you ?

[Alson]

Anyone?

[UserUnfriendly]

the acid katana is nice, but the moonblade +5!!!!

is so much better...

unfortuantely, you have to beat up the eclipse party to get it...

however, i managed to somehow spoof it out, after defeating bodhi, by force talking sola with everyone in paraty, and sleeping in druid grove...

might be a fluke...

main char with uai has dual moonblade and acid...giggle...


ok, one problem with kensai mages is no g whirlwind, so you will be getting gloves of serious weapon whacking...ouch...in watchers keep lv 5, and using imp haste a lot....

so you might give up ring of free action, the best immunity item in game, to sola.


but in a prepared attack, you cast imp haste on yourself, and whirl into attack with dual katanas, and then put ring ON...ring protects you from stun, hold, web and sometimes domination and chaos...might be bug...

memorize black blade of disaster, read my posts on black blade and on "spoofing the acid ninja" for painless kurosian takedowns, and force stacking spell immunites is what undead sola does...

littiz is the big authority on kensai mages, id try figher mage multis myself...sola is killer....


nut you should piskc spells you can chain contingency, for offensive use, and rely on whirling into attack, chain contingecny for magic strike, and pressing home the attack physically while a little bomb goes off from you as the chain triggers....


sunfire and abu are your friends...

simmy is your buddy, and spell trigger triple sunfires for emergencys...

[Stilgar]

Just a question, can a kensai/mage ware a robe?
I though the kensai abilaty to not be able to wear armour also counted after a dual.......

[Bruce Lee]

If you dualed at level 13 you wont need tensor unless it is an absolute emergency.
Once haerdalis is of high enough level have him sing, it is like a group free action ring with no drawbacks.
Black blade of disaster is obviously good with Kai.
Robe of good archmagi perhaps..or that robe you can have your apprentice make...what is it called?
Must spells, mirror image, stoneskin, prot from magical weapons,
imp haste, mislead, simulacrum, shapechange, black blade of disaster.
So you will have Haer'dalis, Kensai/mage, Kelsey, Soulafein and who else?
You like spells eh?
Well spells are cool!

[Glod]

Stilgar you still can't wear "armor" but robes aren't classified as armor for this purpose by the game.

The robe of apprenti (made for you in mage stronghold) is AC 3 IIRC so for pure AC it would be the way to go.

The gloves of "serious weapon wacking " aren't usable by you unless you're hacking AFAIK as kensai can't use bracers/gloves.

The acid katana is ridiculously good. I'd recommend offhanding a +1 attack weapon (belm, kundane) for general use and give crom to one of your other tanks. You only really need 1 prof in the offhand weapn as you're using it mostly for effects.

There are tons of posts on trigger/contingency combos/exploits that should be easy to find with a forum search.

Once tensered you can't recast stoneskin or other defenses so
lots of times, especially late in the game, it didnt seem worth it even in the big battles.

[Littiz]

I'm flattered...

@User: again, you assume every kensai has UAI as Bun-Bun...
No armor, BRACERS or helmets for a kensai!
Though ROBES, and IOUN STONES are available.

Alson: I would be glad to help, but, if you fail in the BASICS!!!
How could you let the robe of Vecna to another party member?!?!?!

I admit many of my high level strategies are tied with that
incredible robe.

Also, though I'm flattered to be asked about kensai/mages,
I've realized that my style of play doesn't count many followers..
I like to play unbuffed and all!
For example, of course Tenser is a spell that requires a certain
caution, for it disables spell casting, BUT it's very helpful
to have it readied in a trigger for VERY nasty situations (in combo
with Improved Haste and Mislead), as it HEALS you while making
you a formidable melee opponent...
Fighter/Mages lack in healing after all.
And I always use DEFENSIVE contingencies!

Anyway, check this
thread in which I have summarized my main strategies in a couple of replays.
I can find others, if you want!

[UserUnfriendly]

oh well, i always forget...

[Alson]

@ Bruce - my party will be:
1. Kensai(13)/Mage
2. Korgan
3. Kelsey
4. Jaheira
5. An imported Swashbuckler(10)/Cleric (no, it's not a multiplayer game...)
6. This is where i'm debating. I REALLY want sola, but i already have one Fighter/Mage, so i took H'D. What do you guys say?
Blade vs. Fighter/Mage??? I just think two multis in a party would be too slow, but sola comes with plenty of quests... maybe i'll just SK sola into a blade!!! I'm sure User will aprove...

@ Littiz - after reading the link, you convinced me i should take the Robe of Vecna to myself... And i do want you to advise me about playing-style, because i like to play unbuffed too! that's why i love contigecies and sequencers and triggers so much...

[Alson]

BTW - Just thought of something...
All the 4th level spell slots (for the Kensai/Mage) will be filled mostly with stoneskin, and the 6th level slots are filled mostly with contigencies and misleads. All this spells can only be cast on 'Self'.
Because level 4 and 6 spells are pretty lame on pure damage spells, Kelsey will have Spirit Armor and Improved Haste, both can be cast on anyone. These spells will make me much tougher defensively AND offensively!
Any thoughts?
Is it a good idea?

[Thrar]

using [chain] contingencies in battle isnt what they r meant to b used for, but if u like to...
on lvl6, i use 4 imp hastes 2 prot from magical energy. imp haste is almost as fast as whirlwind, lasts much longer and can b cast much earlier, a must for any party that has fighters in it. prot from magical energy so that i can use skull traps from behind. later on not as necessary i think, as u have party-friendly dragons breath/abu dalzim, so other things might of better use. for fighting mages (dual or multi) 1 or 2 tensers, and when u have more than 1 mage in party, powerword: silence 2-3 times.
for emergency cases maybe a prot from magical weapons, but i tend to put it into contingency instead of casting it.
lvl4 is stoneskin, gr malison, imp inviso and emotion:heartbreak.
depending on # of mages u have, but at least 3 gr malisons imo (and i like to put them into spell sequencer too, with 2 times emotion:heartbreak - dunno what else to use as 3rd spell), 2 stoneskins per mage (1 cast right after rest, the other when needed), a few imp inviso to decrease fighter AC, and even on high lvl 2-3 emotion:heartbreak combined with gr malison can save the day. gr malison ownz (use with symbol stun for even more fun).
other things i heard would b wizard eye and secret word, but i dont use them myself.
have a minor sequencer activated, i would put in mirror image/resist fear for defense casting, but its not a big deal.

[island007]

Hi

I thought on 4th level spells. The fire shields are pretty good. It is nice to use them in conjuction with stoneskin on the really hard fights. Littiz has a really nice pic of PC in a purple fire shield. I saw that and had to copy it. Littiz has alot of nice ideas on this topic run a search for the username. You will be glad you did.

Thanks

[Littiz]

long... bear me

ok, let's do something more detailed!
I'm invasive as always, though requested to, for once!
I'll explain MY strats and choices, so you'll be able to use them as a suggestion or adapt them to suit better your own needs, if you want.
Of course you can give the spells you mentioned to Kelsey (nice strategy), though I prefer to have all that I need myself!

These are the spells that I used to keep memorized just before
the END of Ascension.
I've spent MONTHS to build this chart (!), I had D'akkon blade,
ring of Wiz and the (quest) added slot spells.
I don't go for excessive multiple memorizations (level 2 is the
exception),they usually do very good just so, and I manage to
minimize rests!
After all I have always more choices to do similar things..
And don't forget the use of Limited Wish, when you judge this selection!
Also they're chosen in this very order to pass to the simmies.
And they're planned together with the triggers..
Also I have the Improved Cloak +2, which grants an additional
Imp. Invisibility AND Imp. Haste.

Level One
-Magic Missile x2 (as spell-interrupter, fast M.Images remover, ecc)
-Prot. from Evil
-Chrom. Orb (just in case..)
-Spook x2 (to avoid bloodsheds)

Level Two
-Blur x2
-Mirror Image x3
-Horror (to avoid bloodsheds)

Level Three
-Melf's M. M. (so your kensai HAS a ranged attack... and WAY more than this)
-Skull Trap x2
-Remove Magic
-Dispel Magic (useful -too- when your Images wanna dispel themselves..)
-Lighting Bolt (VERY powerful, if you could learn how to use it...)

Level Four
-Imp.Invisibility
-Stoneskin x2
-Spirit Armor
-Fire Shield Red
-Fire Shiel Blue (these two needed together for the cool combo effect!!! )

Level Five
-Breach
-Sunfire (when sorrounded)
-Shadow Door (to save a level 4 slot from another invisibilty pick)
-Cone of Cold
-Spell Immunity x2(ehehehehehehehe)

Level Six
-Prot.M. Weap.x2 (your REAL defense. Even against special damage..)
-Imp. Haste (0 casting time if you're well equipped.. killer)
-Tenser
-True Sight (1 casting time..)
-Chain Lighting (party friendly)
-Mislead

Level Seven
-R.R.Reversal
-D.B.Fireball
-Mord. Sword
-P.Word Stun (to avoid bloodsheds)
-Limited Wish (to regain 1 spell/level from 1th to 4th!!!!!)
-Project Image x2 (Eheheheheheheheheheheheh)

Level Eight
-Abi Dalzim
-Prot. from Energy
-Inc. Cloud
-Symbol: Stun (to avoid bloodsheds)
-Pierce Magic
-Simulacrum (Ehehehehehehehehe)

Level Nine
-Time Stop
-Spell Trap
-Imp. Alacrity
-Wish
-Black Blade of Disaster (only vs monsters, TOO killer to use it against people...and for the last Ascension battle!! )


CONTINGENCIES (prepare then rest again, you won't use them ALL
the time, only when things go REALLY bad, and in the hardest
battles, after which an additional rest may be fitting )

"Normal": 50% hp, Prot. From Magical Weapons
"Chain": 50% hp, Mirror Image, Mislead, Prot. from Energy.

Then ALWAYS fight, and use potions (USE THEM!!),to keep ABOVE 50% hps...
Notice the mix: both "physical" and "illusionary" protections,
area spell protections, cannot be targeted by direct spells,
total melee protection.
If this isn't enough, surely you gain the time to cast Time
Stop uninterrupted. Then maybe Imp. Alacrity + the rest of your
arsenal....
And emerge victorious from a dramatic battle!!!



TRIGGERS (as for Contingencies...)

-Minor Spell Sequencer:
quite free choice...

-Sequencer:
Stoneskin, Imp. Invisibility, Mirror Image.
Again, notice the mix, quite the defense..

-Spell Trigger:
Imp. Haste, Tenser, Mislead.
Heals you and keeps you out of trouble.
Doubled hps!!!!!!


You may find triggers a bit redundant with the contingencies.
Surely many players would prefer offensive combos.
I leave those to the other mages in my party, if I have any,
as I assure that a couple of times I was really saved by
the triggers, when everything else was depleted!
If others die, I can resurrect them, if I die, game-over!
(so it's assumed by the game...something to do with Bhaal????)

one last thing:
ALWAYS set autopause-end of round, for Alacrity...


@Island: thanx for the credit!! A note on fireshields:
I know there are better spells in that very level, but
fireshields are cool, 'cause when you're immune to damage,
enemies only suffer from their hits!!
Kelsey has a cloak that grants a NEW Green Fireshield...
Got to try all of three together...

[Alson]

Wow... thanx!

Great reply Littiz!
Thanx alot, the list gave me a bunch of new ideas!

I was surprised to read that YOU of all people use the 'set permenant spell and rest again' tactic! That means another 8 hours for immie at Spellhold!! But then again, a good sleep is always a good thing before a tough battle, and immie wouldn't want you to get hurt, would she?

The list, IMHO, looks like a solo list, with alot of spells that i intend to leave for others (like Protection from Evil and R.R. of Reversal, for example). The Fireshield combo seems cool - i think i'm going to try that one!
Anyway, thanx for the help!


BTW - just saw a post by you, and i totally agree....
GO IRON MAIDEN!!

[Aranan]

Littiz... you've nearly managed to convince me to dual to a mage instead of a thief with my kensai. I'm level 12 right now and so far I was going to go for Thief... argh, Kensage looks AWESOME.

Here's my party:
Kensai (dualed to... eh... thief or mage)
Half Orc Berserker (played by my friend, this is a multiplayer game btw)
Korgan (Yeah, my buddy likes berserkers )
Nalia (Getting Imoen shortly..)
Viconia

So, mage or thief? Which one would be more useful to the party?

EDIT: BTW, if anyone ever is looking for some info on a kensai/mage, just do a search for any of Littiz's posts. Wow, those things are gems!

[genxooseven]

This is a little off topic from Alson's question, but since we are talking about Kensai's and such do you think my newly created solo Kensai will stand a chance playing in insane mode? Never played Kensai really and wanted to give him a try. I also plan on dualling him into a mage, but at lv 39+ (dunno i just like high levels). So do you think I should give it a try or am I just asking to hit the reload button over n over?

P.S. My apologies for not creating a new topic Alson, but couldn't resist.

[Littiz]

HEY, of course I didn't rest in SpellHold!!
Took Immie and flew away with the (sucky) spells she had at
the moment (I cannot blame her, she was confused )
I you can do the 2 rests trick in an Inn.
In ToB you have the Pocket Plane, and this (legal) trick:

-Cast Spell Trap
-Cast Project Image
-Image (or Immie) cast a high level spell at you to RECHARGE
the Project Image (power words, or prot. from energy work good)
-Image tries casting Wish to get the rest option
-Repeat from point 2.

Boring, but I have to save the world, so from a roleplaying
PoV I can set all the triggers I need!!!!


About the Chart, I was not soloing, but I want to be ABLE
to handle all the situations.
And remember that during your Time Stop you're the only one
able to cast, so if you want to do a complete spell-buffing
you have to cast those spells yourself.
Couple of quick notes:
-Changed the ORDER of 9th level spell for the last battle
-Still debating with myself about Maze (powerful, life sparing,
and FUN!!) Without another mage in party, it would take the place
of Inc. Cloud
-Another mage is really helpful anyway (Immie?), to cast
Power Word: Blind, Planetar, Dragon Breath...

With the casting_time_reducing_items, Images appear INSTANTLY,
also they can cast spells immediatly (why not, Time Stop with
casting time 4....)
Happened to me once:
-Autopause: Enemy sighted (Hive Mother, ToB)
-Image appears AT THE VERY MOMENT by my side
-Image Casts Time Stop
-Image Casts a bunch of spells + Wish
-Hive Mother dies
-Get the rest option!!!
In "external" time: Hive Mother spotted, Image at the SAME TIME appears
and casts time stop, everything explodes and I'm fully readied again,
BUT with the Image still there!
+50.000 XPs........

If you're in the mood for another verbose post, in the ToB forum
I explained how I won the final Ascension Battle (after a week of
efforts... HARDEST thing in ALL my computer-gaming life.. but fun!)

@genxooseven: maybe 39 is too high to dual...
but ask Bruce Lee for advices about straight kensais

@Aranan: I think you're not asking such advice from ME!
Thanx for the "gems"!
I only collect common knowledge, and maybe now and then come up
with an idea of mine...

[Alson]

Originally posted by Littiz

And remember that during your Time Stop you're the only one
able to cast, so if you want to do a complete spell-buffing
you have to cast those spells yourself.
Couple of quick notes:
-Changed the ORDER of 9th level spell for the last battle
-Still debating with myself about Maze (powerful, life sparing,
and FUN!!) Without another mage in party, it would take the place
of Inc. Cloud
-Another mage is really helpful anyway (Immie?), to cast
Power Word: Blind, Planetar, Dragon Breath...

OK, thanx, forgot about the Time Stop thing... So i guess i will memorize some debuffers like R.R. of Reversal and Truesight.
Though i'm not the main spellcaster in the party - Kelsey is, so most of the spellpower will be on his hands. To compensate me, he is 'willing' to give me the ROBE...

[Aranan]

Littiz, Sharlay (my Kensai) will try and follow (somewhat) in Duriella's footsteps. Somewhat, because I'm not super good like you. Chaotic Neutral with evil tendancies is more like it

I've got a couple kensage thread bookmarked now for quick reference. Especially this one with the spell suggestions and such. Thanks all, and another thank-you to Littiz

[Littiz]

What have I done?!?

I uncovered the Secret of Steel and you use it to spread havoc
and destruction!?!?
My fault... have to redeem now

Anyway, this discussion made me think about sorcs... Never tried
them until Tashia and Kelsey.
Indeed they're good, not maybe IMHO as a PC, as they lack something,
but indeed they are the best COMPLEMENT for a party...
Alson has a point: just find spells that are more useful for your party composition,
give them to the sorc, and you'll have and endless supply of those!
From this PoV, I realize there may be brand new strategies involving
sorcs in the party