i m a complet newb in soa and i m wondering when is the best time to dual nalia and anomoen? does it matter at which lvl?
thx
MoKa
when to dual nalia and anomoen
Now, I may be a bit rusty on this area as I haven't played in a while... But aren't both Anomen and Nalia dual-classed already? I *know* Anomen can't change classes again as he already dualed to a cleric, and I think Nalia dualed over to a mage...?
Edit: Yup. Skuld beat me to it.
Edit: Yup. Skuld beat me to it.
"There are worse things in the world than serving the whims of a deadly sex goddess." - Zevran
Nalia wants you to save her family's castle from an attack. Anomen doesn't have any quest like that to give you; he just wants to accompany you on your adventures. Nalia's quest is appropriate for someone who has barely started the game. You don't have to let her join your group; you can save her family's castle without her. But if you want her in your party, go ahead and let her join now, and if you want Anomen in your group, go ahead and let him join your group now, too.
I don't see anywhere in his post that he's implying he needs help deciding which quest to do first, but you can divert attention from the fact that he's asked a question that shouldn't have even been asked all you want. Sorry dude.
"I'll take the stupid one who decided to threaten us, instead of shoot us when he had the chance" - Bao-Dur
I'm not sure exactly what you mean, Skuld, but my intention was simply to offer some helpful information to MoKa since he said he was a complete newbie. Judging from his question, I assumed that Nalia and Anomen were not in his party yet, and I was simply encouraging him to get them now if he wants them. Sorry if I went too far off-topic.
Re: make it clear
Well, here's the lowdown as simple as I can put it.
Multi-class is for races other than human. It's where a Character begins the game with 2 (or 3) classes and is active with both of them. Dual-classing means you're active with only one class at a time.
Dual-class, which only humans can do, happens when a character begins the game with Class 1, then eventually changes to Class 2. A character can only Dual-Class once.
You can't change Nalia's and Anomen's class again because they were already dual-classed before you even started the game. No matter how far you level them up, they can never switch in the game again (Without cheating).
Hope maybe this clears the issue.
And people, let's all be nice now. No need to get mad over helpful comments, is there?
Originally posted by MoKa
i think i have to ask in another way. when anomoen and nalia get lvlups one can decide to click on the dualclass button. so which lvl is the best to change them? or perhaps i dont get it what the difference between dual and multiclass is.
on a wave
MoKa
Well, here's the lowdown as simple as I can put it.
Multi-class is for races other than human. It's where a Character begins the game with 2 (or 3) classes and is active with both of them. Dual-classing means you're active with only one class at a time.
Dual-class, which only humans can do, happens when a character begins the game with Class 1, then eventually changes to Class 2. A character can only Dual-Class once.
You can't change Nalia's and Anomen's class again because they were already dual-classed before you even started the game. No matter how far you level them up, they can never switch in the game again (Without cheating).
Hope maybe this clears the issue.
And people, let's all be nice now. No need to get mad over helpful comments, is there?
"There are worse things in the world than serving the whims of a deadly sex goddess." - Zevran
Yup, you can only dual class once. Sorry. And If you're a complete newbie I'd keep my distance from dual classing(unless it's already been done like in the case of Nalia or Anomen) until you get the machanics of the game down. Maybe try one next time around.
"I'll take the stupid one who decided to threaten us, instead of shoot us when he had the chance" - Bao-Dur
MoKa, the best way to learn about character development is to experiment with characters yourself and see what suits you. For example, different people have different ideas about when to dual-class a Fighter or dual-class a Thief. Typically, 9th Level (in the case of a Fighter, a Fighter kit, or a Thief), 10th Level (in the case of a Swashbuckler), and 13th Level are a good time to dual-class. It depends on how many abilities you want to have in your first class and how long you're willing to wait before the original class becomes active again. (You can't use any of the abilities of the first class until the second class is one level higher than the first.) For example, a 9th Level Thief has enough thieving skills to get by and has a 4x backstab multiplier, but a 13th Level Thief is even more skilled and has better abilities like setting traps and a 5x backstab multiplier. A 13th Level Fighter has a pretty good THAC0 and lots of proficiency points and hit points. But it takes a long time to reach 14th Level in the second class, so some people choose to dual-class at 9th Level. It's a tradeoff.
Now, if Nalia and Anomen are already in your party, take a look at their character record screens. They are already dual-classed. Take a look at the "Dual Class" button. It is greyed out, and you can't activate it. So there's no need to worry about dual-classing Nalia and Anomen. Personally, I think that Nalia's Thief level is too low, so I don't bother using her as a Thief. I treat her as a Mage who can wield a bow. Anomen is a 7th Level Fighter dual-classed to a Cleric. Personally, I don't think 7th Level is high enough. But you can't change it unless you cheat. Anomen is still a pretty powerful character, so you probably won't notice the difference.
If you look at the details, you might notice that Anomen should not have been able to dual-class. In order to be able to dual-class, a character must meet the minimum stat requirements. A Fighter can't dual-class unless his Strength is at least 17 and the primary stat for the second class is also 17. Anomen's Wisdom is only 14, so he should not have been able to dual-class. But that's the way the designers made him, so who are we to argue?
Now, if Nalia and Anomen are already in your party, take a look at their character record screens. They are already dual-classed. Take a look at the "Dual Class" button. It is greyed out, and you can't activate it. So there's no need to worry about dual-classing Nalia and Anomen. Personally, I think that Nalia's Thief level is too low, so I don't bother using her as a Thief. I treat her as a Mage who can wield a bow. Anomen is a 7th Level Fighter dual-classed to a Cleric. Personally, I don't think 7th Level is high enough. But you can't change it unless you cheat. Anomen is still a pretty powerful character, so you probably won't notice the difference.
If you look at the details, you might notice that Anomen should not have been able to dual-class. In order to be able to dual-class, a character must meet the minimum stat requirements. A Fighter can't dual-class unless his Strength is at least 17 and the primary stat for the second class is also 17. Anomen's Wisdom is only 14, so he should not have been able to dual-class. But that's the way the designers made him, so who are we to argue?
Originally posted by VonDondu
Anomen's Wisdom is only 14, so he should not have been able to dual-class. But that's the way the designers made him, so who are we to argue?
But you'd never miss the missing Wisdom points as they're only good for useless first-to-third level spells anyway.
Von is right here, though. Dual-classing is fun to experiment with when testing out characters. Characters like Yoshimo are good candidates for Dual classing, but it's one hard climb to be a seventh level Theif to a first level warrior, just gaining new abilities and having to rely on low resources of the basic levels of the new class.
...I applaude anyone who understands what I just said.
BG2's dual-classing system is a complex, confusing thing. Usually, you don't want to dual until your character has gained all of the special abilities that class gives them. If you're playing with a Kit, however, you just have to decide what skills you want and which ones you'd be willing to sacrafice.
I have never dualed a character past level 14. It's too hard to bring up a character to get past that. I usually end up getting killed because I just don't have the necessary abilities to keep said character alive long enough. Anomen and Nalia were dualed just a bit too early to be uber-powerful with thier first classes, but Nalia did get *some* thieving abilities and Anomen got it good on the Hit Point count. (This is especially useful with all those cruddy undead - you just cant use a pure Cleric like Viccy up front in battle because her HP is slightly in the gutter.)
But if your main character is a Theif and all you can dual to is a Mage, then (I believe) you're better off just moving along without switching. The game has PLENTY of Thief/Mages.
"There are worse things in the world than serving the whims of a deadly sex goddess." - Zevran
Silence, Hold Person, Dispel Magic, and Animate Dead are not useless spells. Sorry but it's been a while and those are the spells I remember using the most. Although most of the level 1 spells are pretty useless.
"I'll take the stupid one who decided to threaten us, instead of shoot us when he had the chance" - Bao-Dur
Originally posted by Skuld
Silence, Hold Person, Dispel Magic, and Animate Dead are not useless spells. Sorry but it's been a while and those are the spells I remember using the most. Although most of the level 1 spells are pretty useless.
If they're that important to you then just take Viconia or Aerie.
I rarely used anything under level three, and when using Anomen I sure don't miss them because half the time he loses the spell from attacks as he's one of my front-liners.
I have *never*, in my entire gaming life, used the silence spell. Rarely, I use paralyzation and holds with my mages, and I prefer the Animal Summonings over the undead as they are more powerful anyway. I just find that most of them can be topped with better spells. But your gaming style is yours and mine is my own.
"There are worse things in the world than serving the whims of a deadly sex goddess." - Zevran
I don't mean to criticize anyone else's gaming preferences, but here are my own preferences.
I use 1st, 2nd, and 3rd Level Priest spells all the time, no matter what level my characters are. I even let Minsc use his Druid spells. My favorite low level spells are Doom, Armor of Faith, Remove Fear (ever been hit with Horror, Dragon Fear, etc.?), Draw Upon Holy Might, Hold Person, Animate Dead, and Glyph of Warding (the Holy Hand Grenade). I rarely use spells like Bless, Chant, and Aid when I play BG2, but they came in handy in BG1 when my characters had trouble hitting anything. For that matter, I used all the spells I could in BG1--they're one of the things that weaned me off of my original reliance on ranged weapons in every battle. I guess some people think that Clerics don't do anything but heal the party, but they have offenses and defenses that can put even Fighters at a disadvantage. Fighter/Clerics rock, but only if they use their spells.
BTW, Silence 15' Radius would be a very useful spell if the enemy AI scripts didn't counter it with Vocalize every time you cast it. That's the only reason I don't bother casting it, and it's a shame. Miscast Magic is a nice alternative, but I'm usually too busy to cast it. Holy Word is also a good way to disrupt other spellcasters, and it can be cast almost instaneously, but it's a high level spell.
Anomen should definitely be played as a front-line fighter. But I still take advantage of his spells. I like to buff him up before the battle with Armor of Faith, Draw Upon Holy Might, and Protection from Evil (as well as higher level spells like Righteous Magic--which guarantees maximum damage on every hit--and Blade Barrier and Shield of the Archons, which protects against Dispel Magic as well as offensive spells). I also like to summon a fighting buddy for Anomen with Animate Dead; allies always come in handy, especially skeleton warriors. Harm and Holy/Unholy Word are also worth casting, as well as the occasional Flamestrike. (Ever been hit by a Harm spell? It's scary.) There are also several protection spells which come in handy, such as Death Ward, Negative Plane Protection, Free Action, Chaotic Commands, etc., and those too can be cast before the battle. There are also spells like True Seeing, which let him see what he's hitting. Just because it's inconvenient to cast spells in the middle of combat, I don't see that as a reason not to use them at all.
I'd also like to mention that when I'm fighting undead creatures, I let Anomen turn them. Making them explode is cool. But even if they aren't destroyed, turning them prevents them from attacking you, which is a tremendous benefit. Anomen can then attack them and they won't fight back. At high level, this works even against liches.
BTW, I'm not particularly fond of Anomen (I much prefer characters like Morte in Planescape: Torment, who was performed by the same voice actor), but I have played a Berserker dualled to Cleric and a multi-class Cleric/Ranger before, and that's how I learned most of the information above. But the strategies I used when playing them also apply to Anomen or any other Fighter/Cleric-type of character, including Jaheira, who also rocks if you're patient and focused and take advantage of her abilities.
MoKa, I think you mentioned in another thread that you don't have a manual. That's a shame, because the manual is great place to read spell descriptions. I advise you to find an alternative and learn as much as you can about spells since you want to play with spellcasters like Anomen and Nalia. I congratulate you for making the decision to use spellcasters. I just hope you take advantage of their powers.
I use 1st, 2nd, and 3rd Level Priest spells all the time, no matter what level my characters are. I even let Minsc use his Druid spells. My favorite low level spells are Doom, Armor of Faith, Remove Fear (ever been hit with Horror, Dragon Fear, etc.?), Draw Upon Holy Might, Hold Person, Animate Dead, and Glyph of Warding (the Holy Hand Grenade).
I rarely use spells like Bless, Chant, and Aid when I play BG2, but they came in handy in BG1 when my characters had trouble hitting anything. For that matter, I used all the spells I could in BG1--they're one of the things that weaned me off of my original reliance on ranged weapons in every battle. I guess some people think that Clerics don't do anything but heal the party, but they have offenses and defenses that can put even Fighters at a disadvantage. Fighter/Clerics rock, but only if they use their spells.BTW, Silence 15' Radius would be a very useful spell if the enemy AI scripts didn't counter it with Vocalize every time you cast it. That's the only reason I don't bother casting it, and it's a shame. Miscast Magic is a nice alternative, but I'm usually too busy to cast it. Holy Word is also a good way to disrupt other spellcasters, and it can be cast almost instaneously, but it's a high level spell.
Anomen should definitely be played as a front-line fighter. But I still take advantage of his spells. I like to buff him up before the battle with Armor of Faith, Draw Upon Holy Might, and Protection from Evil (as well as higher level spells like Righteous Magic--which guarantees maximum damage on every hit--and Blade Barrier and Shield of the Archons, which protects against Dispel Magic as well as offensive spells). I also like to summon a fighting buddy for Anomen with Animate Dead; allies always come in handy, especially skeleton warriors. Harm and Holy/Unholy Word are also worth casting, as well as the occasional Flamestrike. (Ever been hit by a Harm spell? It's scary.)
There are also several protection spells which come in handy, such as Death Ward, Negative Plane Protection, Free Action, Chaotic Commands, etc., and those too can be cast before the battle. There are also spells like True Seeing, which let him see what he's hitting. Just because it's inconvenient to cast spells in the middle of combat, I don't see that as a reason not to use them at all. I'd also like to mention that when I'm fighting undead creatures, I let Anomen turn them. Making them explode is cool.
But even if they aren't destroyed, turning them prevents them from attacking you, which is a tremendous benefit. Anomen can then attack them and they won't fight back. At high level, this works even against liches. BTW, I'm not particularly fond of Anomen (I much prefer characters like Morte in Planescape: Torment, who was performed by the same voice actor), but I have played a Berserker dualled to Cleric and a multi-class Cleric/Ranger before, and that's how I learned most of the information above. But the strategies I used when playing them also apply to Anomen or any other Fighter/Cleric-type of character, including Jaheira, who also rocks if you're patient and focused and take advantage of her abilities.
MoKa, I think you mentioned in another thread that you don't have a manual. That's a shame, because the manual is great place to read spell descriptions. I advise you to find an alternative and learn as much as you can about spells since you want to play with spellcasters like Anomen and Nalia. I congratulate you for making the decision to use spellcasters. I just hope you take advantage of their powers.
No offence taken Von. I was just a little tired and crabby - didn't mean to seem rude in my last post.
A wise spammer once told me that there are two kinds of gamers - the people who prepare for fights with defensive spells and usually end up surviving, and then there are folks who take the entire offensive and throw their chances of living up in the air. I'm in the latter.
Sometimes, if I need it (Actually, if I die several times over in the same fight), I'll cast Aid and Chant. It took me a while to catch on that these actually do make a difference sometime. I'm a major organizer when it comes to spell groups... I find that it works better for me if I divide offensive and defensive spells in between Clerics. I give all the Aids, Chants, Slow Poisons, Cure Diseases, Dispel Magics (ect) up to Viccie/Aerie in the back. Since Anomen is my main undead/evil fron-liner, I put him with the Holy, Summoning and damage inflicting spells. Cause Critical Wounds, Holy Word, Flamestrike... I seem to save spell slots this way.
I was just a little tired and crabby - didn't mean to seem rude in my last post. A wise spammer once told me that there are two kinds of gamers - the people who prepare for fights with defensive spells and usually end up surviving, and then there are folks who take the entire offensive and throw their chances of living up in the air. I'm in the latter.
Sometimes, if I need it (Actually, if I die several times over in the same fight), I'll cast Aid and Chant. It took me a while to catch on that these actually do make a difference sometime.
I'm a major organizer when it comes to spell groups... I find that it works better for me if I divide offensive and defensive spells in between Clerics. I give all the Aids, Chants, Slow Poisons, Cure Diseases, Dispel Magics (ect) up to Viccie/Aerie in the back. Since Anomen is my main undead/evil fron-liner, I put him with the Holy, Summoning and damage inflicting spells. Cause Critical Wounds, Holy Word, Flamestrike... I seem to save spell slots this way. "There are worse things in the world than serving the whims of a deadly sex goddess." - Zevran
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JackOfClubs
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Originally posted by Aqua-chan
I'm a major organizer when it comes to spell groups... I find that it works better for me if I divide offensive and defensive spells in between Clerics. I give all the Aids, Chants, Slow Poisons, Cure Diseases, Dispel Magics (ect) up to Viccie/Aerie in the back. Since Anomen is my main undead/evil fron-liner, I put him with the Holy, Summoning and damage inflicting spells. Cause Critical Wounds, Holy Word, Flamestrike... I seem to save spell slots this way.
I have done this occasionally, but I find it has some potential dangers. If you have all of your healing spells on one character, and that character gets taken out of action (by fear, hold, stun or more permanent disabilities) then that character cannot help the rest of the party. A similar problem occurs, if all of your offensive characters get taken out and you only have defensive spells to deal with the remaining monsters.
Admittedly, this doesn't happen very often, but I find it useful to have backups for both defensive and offensive characters.
Resistance to Tyrants is Service to God.