in another thread in this forum was a topic about wizards and their two spells they get when they advance in level.
it was mentioned that wizards gain their spells when they advance "provided" their is time to research.
now, if this wizard did not have time to research (i.e. no access to a library and/or constantly on the move like in a dungeon perhaps) does this wizard not get his/her spells when they advance? Do they therefore get them at a later time when they do have time to research?
I always concidered it was this way. The two free spells with level advancement do not just "pop" into the head of the wizard (as they might with a sorceror for example). The two free spells simply means that when a wizard advances in level they do not have to roll for "chance to learn spell" --- that is, they can get two spells automatically without having to do the check. But, they have to have access to these spells somehow so that they can learn them at all.
is this right?
wizards and level up spells
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Rob-hin
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It's all up to the DM.
Your way seems right but it's a serious disadvantage for the wizard. He practically remains the same even though he levels up.
My reasoning for cases where there is no library available is different.
The wizard can also improve his own spells or create new ones them himself. So you can take an low level spell and find a spell similar to it but of a higher level. Self created spells means you can pick two yourself normally.
Your way seems right but it's a serious disadvantage for the wizard. He practically remains the same even though he levels up.
My reasoning for cases where there is no library available is different.
The wizard can also improve his own spells or create new ones them himself. So you can take an low level spell and find a spell similar to it but of a higher level. Self created spells means you can pick two yourself normally.
Guinness is good for you.
Gives you strength.
Gives you strength.
yeah, that is an excellent idea. I thought of that, but thought to myself that the wizard would not have time to do this research while dungeon crawling for example, but I guess this is not true. The wizard could always find a little time here and there when they rest to study up on his own spells a bit and say that the cumulative effect of a lot of little studies add up to the needed research for the 2 level advancement spells.
when you do this however, do you restrict your wizard to spells that are similar/related to what they already have, or do you let them pick from the entire list of available spells? It would seem to me that only being able to pick from related/similar spells would make more sense. Is this what you do?
when you do this however, do you restrict your wizard to spells that are similar/related to what they already have, or do you let them pick from the entire list of available spells? It would seem to me that only being able to pick from related/similar spells would make more sense. Is this what you do?
it just seems like picking a wizards spells is like picking what weapon your fighter is going to specialize in. I always felt that sort of thing is kind of "sacred ground" for the player character, and unless there is a good reason it should always be left up to the player. But if you guys like it, then all the better.
yes, i agree. D&D is not math. I dont know who said it was, cause they are definitly wrong about that. It is not math. Agreed. I dont even know why we are talking about D&D not being math, cause no one in this post ever said it was. All I was saying is that it seems to me like choosing a wizards spells is like choosing a fighters weapons. Thats all. I didnt say it was wrong. I was just curious how it worked in Rob-hin's game cause I am always interested in "house" rules, and why people choose the ones they do.
my house rules
Seeing as you're interested in house rules, I have some for you to comment
Spells:
Mage's Disjunction works as written, though I'd it like if we made a deal not to use it.
Shapechange does not grant (su) abilities, and it grows at 1HD/level, capping at 25 HD.
You can only have one of each of the following groups of contingent effects active:
Lower Spell Resistance does not give an saving throw penalty. At these levels, that means all but removing the save.
Starmantle does not work with (improved) evasion.
You cannot use Imbue With Spell Ability to qualify for classes, feats, etc.
Fanfare is banned.
If you become a template through spells, or anything, you still have to pay the appropriate ECL.
Classes:
We use the 3.5 Shifter detailed here
No Hulking Hurler or Warhulk
No Maho Tsukai
The Kensai uses his ranks in concentration as reflex save, instead of his total modifier.
If you take a class that grants an extra stat to AC (Monk, Mystic Wanderer, etc.), it grants a bonus equal to your level in the class or your ability modifier, whichever is less (Like the Duelist).
Hathran gets one cohort max.
Max 3 Core Classes and PRC's at the time of creation.
Books:
No Ghostwalk
No Greyhawk
No psionics
No Book of Vile Darkness
No Miniatures Handbook
No Arms & Equipment Guide
No Stronghold Builder's Guide
You cannot combine Forgoten Realms books and Oriental Adventures, you are from one material plane or the other.
Feats, skills etc:
Intuitive attack is now an epic feat
New feat: :
Devastating Sneak (EPIC)
You strike with a combination of finesse and power, so that you can damage even creatures made of solid rock.
Prereqs: Sneak attack +8d6, Crippling Strike class feature, strength 25+
Benefit: You ignore 25% resistance to critical hits. (For example, when sneak attacking someone with a Light Fortification armor, you ignore the chance that the critical is negated. This decreases the crit immunity of undead and constructs to 75%. This feat only works in conjunction with Sneak Attack.
Special: You can take this feat up to 4 times. Its effects stack.
Iajutsu Focus Does not work against creatures immune to criticals. (And not with thrown Katanas)
You cannot use Southern Magician to qualify for classes, feats, etc.
Epic:
Minimum Spell DC is the equal to the highest base DC among seeds used.
Mitigating Factors up to -45
For the record: Nonpermanent effects do NOT give bonus spells. Tomes do.
If you need an Epic Progression for a class, just ask me.
Items:
Items that grant SR cost ((bonus over 12)^2) X 250gp. SR over 32 is epic.
You can only take intelligent items if you craft them yourself.
You cannot reduce the cost of an item by making it usable only by....
Seeing as you're interested in house rules, I have some for you to comment
Spells:
Mage's Disjunction works as written, though I'd it like if we made a deal not to use it.
Shapechange does not grant (su) abilities, and it grows at 1HD/level, capping at 25 HD.
You can only have one of each of the following groups of contingent effects active:
Code: Select all
Contigency, Chain Contingency, Simbul's ... spells, Elminster's Evasion.
A Contingent spell (crafted)
Item-based contingent effects (such as an attuned gem)Starmantle does not work with (improved) evasion.
You cannot use Imbue With Spell Ability to qualify for classes, feats, etc.
Fanfare is banned.
If you become a template through spells, or anything, you still have to pay the appropriate ECL.
Classes:
We use the 3.5 Shifter detailed here
No Hulking Hurler or Warhulk
No Maho Tsukai
The Kensai uses his ranks in concentration as reflex save, instead of his total modifier.
If you take a class that grants an extra stat to AC (Monk, Mystic Wanderer, etc.), it grants a bonus equal to your level in the class or your ability modifier, whichever is less (Like the Duelist).
Hathran gets one cohort max.
Max 3 Core Classes and PRC's at the time of creation.
Books:
No Ghostwalk
No Greyhawk
No psionics
No Book of Vile Darkness
No Miniatures Handbook
No Arms & Equipment Guide
No Stronghold Builder's Guide
You cannot combine Forgoten Realms books and Oriental Adventures, you are from one material plane or the other.
Feats, skills etc:
Intuitive attack is now an epic feat
New feat: :
Devastating Sneak (EPIC)
You strike with a combination of finesse and power, so that you can damage even creatures made of solid rock.
Prereqs: Sneak attack +8d6, Crippling Strike class feature, strength 25+
Benefit: You ignore 25% resistance to critical hits. (For example, when sneak attacking someone with a Light Fortification armor, you ignore the chance that the critical is negated. This decreases the crit immunity of undead and constructs to 75%. This feat only works in conjunction with Sneak Attack.
Special: You can take this feat up to 4 times. Its effects stack.
Iajutsu Focus Does not work against creatures immune to criticals. (And not with thrown Katanas)
You cannot use Southern Magician to qualify for classes, feats, etc.
Epic:
Minimum Spell DC is the equal to the highest base DC among seeds used.
Mitigating Factors up to -45
For the record: Nonpermanent effects do NOT give bonus spells. Tomes do.
If you need an Epic Progression for a class, just ask me.
Items:
Items that grant SR cost ((bonus over 12)^2) X 250gp. SR over 32 is epic.
You can only take intelligent items if you craft them yourself.
You cannot reduce the cost of an item by making it usable only by....
Beauty is only skin deep, but ugly goes right down to the bone
wow, sounds like you guys have it really fleshed out there. when my group plays, we keep it really basic with respect to books and extra feats/items/spells/equiptment/whatever. We basically only use the core books:
players guide
DMs guide
campaign setting [this one really really loosely]
monsters manual
-- and i think thats about it.
The reason is because I personally feel that beyond these books, anything extra you need or want you can just "invent" for "in-house" play. In fact, I rarely use items straight out of the guides and am nearly always making up my own items/spells/equiptment to suit whatever adventure the players are on. I know its not official, but my players do not have any intentions of taking their characters to any other games anyway. As far as in house rules go, most of ours deals with the combat sequence as we havent had too much time to play our characters up to any levels high enough where the kinds of house rules you are using are necessary. Your guy's house rules sound alot more offical than ours --- sounds like you guys have a very solid game going on. Sounds good
players guide
DMs guide
campaign setting [this one really really loosely]
monsters manual
-- and i think thats about it.
The reason is because I personally feel that beyond these books, anything extra you need or want you can just "invent" for "in-house" play. In fact, I rarely use items straight out of the guides and am nearly always making up my own items/spells/equiptment to suit whatever adventure the players are on. I know its not official, but my players do not have any intentions of taking their characters to any other games anyway. As far as in house rules go, most of ours deals with the combat sequence as we havent had too much time to play our characters up to any levels high enough where the kinds of house rules you are using are necessary. Your guy's house rules sound alot more offical than ours --- sounds like you guys have a very solid game going on. Sounds good
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boo's daddy
- Posts: 247
- Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 9:04 am
- Location: Minsc's coat pocket
- Contact:
House Rules
Here's a house rule I used years ago, and it worked quite well.
All characters got an alignment and class "performance" rating at the end of every session to reflect how well you had role-played your alignment and class. (I think it was a 4-point scale.)
When it came to level-up time you only got the new powers if your rating was perfect throughout. If not, then you had to sacrifice lots of gp to appease your god (if your alignment performance was below par) or spend lots of game time researching your new skills (if your class performance was dodgy).
Obviously, the worse the performance the higher the price.
It seemed to work pretty well, especially as a means of encouraging good role-playing.
IIRC, new spells were always randomly chosen.
Here's a house rule I used years ago, and it worked quite well.
All characters got an alignment and class "performance" rating at the end of every session to reflect how well you had role-played your alignment and class. (I think it was a 4-point scale.)
When it came to level-up time you only got the new powers if your rating was perfect throughout. If not, then you had to sacrifice lots of gp to appease your god (if your alignment performance was below par) or spend lots of game time researching your new skills (if your class performance was dodgy).
Obviously, the worse the performance the higher the price.
It seemed to work pretty well, especially as a means of encouraging good role-playing.
IIRC, new spells were always randomly chosen.