Is there no other way ?

thenenea · Post by **thenenea** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 6:18 am

Is there no other way to get some decent magic items in IWD 2 than playing in Heart of Fury mode ? Because I'm kind of a treasure hunter and after playing BG 1 and 2 I found IWD 2 to be a little empty. And when I finally got some magic items they didn't make so much of a difference (well, they did but that wasn't like enything to write home about and got me wondering why are they so scarce ?). I understand that some of the best items are only availble in Heart of Fury mode and I really don't understand why. If I want to enjoy a medium difficulty game before trying a tougher challange why am I supposed to have access to only second grade stuff ? What's the point? Is that supposed to keep me playing ? I made it untill after the Ice Temple and than dropped the game for a while precisely because I really didn't feel like I was making any real progress. In BG 1 an 8th level party is already very powerfull and you can feel it. They also have weapons, armor and other things to prowe they are a tough party.
To sum it up, does anyone know a mod that enables "the good stuff" in normal difficulty mode? Thanks!

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 6:44 am

no there is no such mod... But i think IWD2 is more realistic that way.. BG1 is short game compared to IWD2 and 8 levels.. that is max number of levels in BG.. but in IWD2 max level number is 30 and you get level 15-24 in playing on normal..(depends on your party...)

But stopping playing in ICE temple? WTF?!?!? you have told this before.. but still what is the whole point in that? IWD serie is for chalenge and unlike BG serie. For me BG serie is nothing but bad plot.. crappy battles.. and boring NPC's.. and it was hard to stand BG1 and i hoped that BG2 would be better.. but it wasn't same old ****.. this is personal point of view.. so it is pointless to say that i am wrong..

Just keep playing..

Download DALEKEEPER II.. and give yourself all those best armors and weapons in the game.. and you will notice that that game will suck even more..

If you play without using dalekeeper.. then when you got those stuff you will need those...

TaZ · Post by **TaZ** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 7:38 am

I think the plot of BG is no worse than that of Icewind Dale. My opinion is that 8 levels are way too few, but 30 are a bit too much. You progress much faster in IWD and it may feel wrong if you're a BG player.

Anyway, just look around in shops, they provide nice items. Why don't you visit the tower in kuldahar in the top left?

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 8:30 am

IWD2 not IWD1.. in IWD1 there was some nice stuff.. but in IWD2 only somescrolls.. and she is (perhaps he not sure) in ICE TEMPLE... and you need to go trough few places before you get to Kuldahar..

Yes.. that thing in BG... you are fightining against forces of evil and then you decide to take 50 years brake on your campaing against Evil wannebees.. and then you can just return and they are waiting for you..

But in IWD serie.. it is now you cant just run away like headless chicken.. you need to face it right now and not tomorrow or after 154 years..

well i am exBG player... and i love things in IWD 1&2.. but IWD2 should have IWD1 music...

thenenea · Post by **thenenea** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 8:30 am

Thanks for the encouragement

I think BG 1&2 and IWD are very different games even if they use the same engine and were made by the same company. I didn't mean that BG1&2 were better and that's usually a matter of personal taste so I don't want to start a debate about that. What I doubted was the designer's decision to impose a certain style of play when all the system was supposed to be about the player making choices. While I realize that the ability to create your entire party and faster leveling up are powerful features I still believe that a little more magical items in the normal mode would be nice. I don’t know, maybe it's just me but the first time I played it felt like a follow up, like I was supposed to import a party from a previous game with all the experience and items I was needing. Don't get me wrong, I think the graphics are very good and the music is fantastic, Targos felt like a town under siege and so on. But was way too empty. And when I've reached the Hooked Horrors caves the game really started to annoy me. On medium difficulty my party was simply too underpowered. I survived the caves but simply got tired of the "fight overwhelmed and underpowered" system. And I did reach Targos but most of the items were very expensive. Again I felt like I should have imported the game because the money I had were mere pocket money and the prices were for the "big league". So if almost everything in the game was designed for the HOF mode why not make that the default? Hell, this game is for advanced players who want to fight goblins who are as tough as ogres and play six hours to get a decent sword and Baldur is for beginners who want to kick ass and have a lot of magic items. It's frustrating when fighting a gang of Goblins and Orcs can be so difficult with a 6 level party ( I'm thinking the entrance to the bugbear fort here ). I finished BG 1 twice and BG 2 with TOB four times and I've never felt overwhelmed once. Chalanged, yes, but overvhelmed by obviously "scripted to be hard" enemies, never. The transition from simpler to much harder enemies seemed more rational. Sorry if I've got on somebody's nerves with this post but I really like the story that seems to unfold in IWD2 and a really want to finish the game. But I have very little time to play and it's very hard to go on when things are so frustrating. So could you please tell me, is it any worth to try the game again on medium settings or should I just skip to HOF to get a decent gameplay ? Thanks.

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 8:42 am

If you think that game is hard now.. HoF will be nightmare.. and when first time playing trough IWD games i would recomend using easiest or easy dificulty.. if you havent used these in other black isle games... tone it down.. IWD2 is hardest game that black isle has created..(IWD1 is right behind) you will get soon some decent weaponry..

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When you meet MALAVON DESPANANA.. head shouth from their camp and you will find out little market.. there is +3-5 weapons and some nice stuff..

thenenea · Post by **thenenea** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 9:01 am

Thanks for the spoiler...

Well it's not the game that felt hard but the learning curve that was pretty steep. I did manage to win those battles, didn't I?

Thanks for the info and I'll try playing again. Maybe this time I'll drag my lasy ass over the finish line.

TaZ · Post by **TaZ** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 2:35 pm

I just completed HoF multiplayer over the internet. We had the following group:
Monk lvl 30
Fighter lvl 22
Cleric lvl 22
Paladin lvl 30
Mage lvl 29
Cleric lvl 29

I really liked it, and we spent 30 minutes or more on the final battle

cause our spells had almost depleted and we were hitting with about just 40 damage per round. HoF mode itself was pretty easy, but that's my opinion. At least we enjoyed it very much!

but about on topic: this was a reaction about HoF being nightmare, but I think it wasn't that bad

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 10:59 pm

Well as i said before.. if you think game is hard now.. HoF will be nightmare for you..

and with Vail of banshee and Malisson almost killing all monsters there is not much chalenge... unless that spell only takes only 3 monsters of 20...

TaZ · Post by **TaZ** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 2:15 am

In entire HoF, my symbol of death never killed one creature

but symbol of hopelessness and greater command work really really good. Used holy word too

thenenea · Post by **thenenea** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 3:23 am

Thanks again for the info

Ok, I think I'll give it another try this weekend so I need your opinions about party composition and what spells and weapons you recommend. I propose the next party:

1. Human Paladin - that one is supposed to be me

- two handed sword and mace
2. Dwarf Cleric - a pretty good tank and can also buff the party before battles - mace and sling probably
3. Halfling Thief - remove traps, unlock chests, scout and backstap with dual small blades - small blades and crossbow
4. Woodelf Ranger - ok, maybe not the best one but I like the idea of a pure archer and maybe get him to dual wield Scimitars

- long bow and scimitars
or
Human Cleric - here I'm not fully decided yet because a second cleric might make a big difference in tough battles - sling and mace
5. Drow Wizard - gonna get some penalties during the day but I think the bonuses worth it - sling and quarterstaff
6. Human or maybe Aasimar Sorcerer - for the situations where a single spell is needed in large quantities - sling and quarterstaff

I intend to keep the classes pure until I get the right "feeling" about the game. Maybe later I'll try a multi-class party but for now I'll stick to this formula.

TaZ · Post by **TaZ** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 4:23 am

Second cleric was a must in my battles. 2 clerics at a time casting heals and mass heals

and summoning some monsters. Btw I had a paladin with 2 times HoF holy avenger

played through it twice

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 7:09 am

[QUOTE=thenenea]Ok, I think I'll give it another try this weekend so I need your opinions about party composition and what spells and weapons you recommend. I propose the next party:

1. Human Paladin - that one is supposed to be me

- two handed sword and mace
2. Dwarf Cleric - a pretty good tank and can also buff the party before battles - mace and sling probably
3. Halfling Thief - remove traps, unlock chests, scout and backstap with dual small blades - small blades and crossbow
4. Woodelf Ranger - ok, maybe not the best one but I like the idea of a pure archer and maybe get him to dual wield Scimitars

- long bow and scimitars
or
Human Cleric - here I'm not fully decided yet because a second cleric might make a big difference in tough battles - sling and mace
5. Drow Wizard - gonna get some penalties during the day but I think the bonuses worth it - sling and quarterstaff
6. Human or maybe Aasimar Sorcerer - for the situations where a single spell is needed in large quantities - sling and quarterstaff

I intend to keep the classes pure until I get the right "feeling" about the game. Maybe later I'll try a multi-class party but for now I'll stick to this formula.[/QUOTE]

Dumb ranger.. and get monk.. and as for thief.. well traps aren't realy bad.. they were in IWD1 but in IWD2 nah nothing but jokes.. and you can open locks with ''knock'' spell.. so perhaps Druid would be better.. in normal druids are best class.. but they get little bit tone down in HoF but still druids have best AC boost spell.. and some nice spells too.. (finger of death, fire storm ect. ect.)+ mass heal and heal...

2 clerics is must..

i would dumb wizard and i would take second sorcerer... (other cast malisson and other vail of banshee...)

improved iniative is must for each spell casting class..

thenenea · Post by **thenenea** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 7:38 am

Hmmm...

Ok, so instead of the second cleric you are proposing a druid ? Sounds interesting and I'll give it a try. As for dumping the wizard for a second sorcerer, hmmm.... That means that until I reach a very high level I won't have too many spells and I'll lack a character with high intelligence to pass the intelligence checks in conversation. Nope, I think I'll keep him.

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 7:54 am

istead of thief i would recomend Druid.. after level 10 sorcerer will be far better than wizard.. and you can give high intelligence to sorserer.. and all those arcana, alchemy things..

TaZ · Post by **TaZ** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 8:09 am

Your primary spellcaster should have much skull traps available, before a major battle, I layed like 8 skull traps and 4 glyphs of warding. They rock

Opalescence · Post by **Opalescence** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 9:43 am

There was this ultimate powergaming guide, by some dude, and while I don't intend to make you take the exact same party he's got some really awesome advice...

For the Dwarven Cleric, make it a Shield Dwarf Battleguard of Tempus (starting with 4 levels of fighter for weapon specialization) and send charisma and intelligence plummeting. It may not be all that wonderful for roleplaying, and you definately don't want him talking for the group, but he becomes an awesome tank, especially when wielding axes (either 2-handed, there are some really good 2-hander axes, or dual wielding two 1-handed axes), and his buffs are great, plus his domain spells rock. Oh yes, and animate dead is useful almost to the end of the game.

You might consider having the Drow to take on the role of both thief and mage. Give him 1 or 2 levels in rogue, then switch to wizard. Not only do rogues get the most skill points, but you really only need so much out of a rogue. You won't get hit with an exp penalty because (I think) drow have wizard as a preferred class. Every time you level up in wizard, get a few rogue skills as cross class. You've got plenty of skillpoints via your high Intel to do that.

I never really like rangers but if you love them than that's fine. Personally, I like Druids too. They've got really decent buffs, and their shapeshifting is pretty good for combat. getting a few levels of monk and then leveling in Druid might be a decent idea (I THINK that monk's benefits to attack spill over to the Druid when he shapeshifts).

For the sorcerer, consider getting 1-3 levels in Paladin. If you do this, you'll miss out on some of the rewards for quests, though, so it's your call (you might also consider multiple sorcerers. If you ask me, an Assimar Sorcerer and a Human Sorcerer. The Assimar will not take paladin levels, the Human will. The Assimar will talk for the group...). I think Paladins have something called "Divine Grace" which adds your charisma bonus to your saving throws. I think you see where this is going. I don't remember, but I think at level 2 or 3 they also get fear immunity and an aura of resist fear or something. After that you really don't need any more Pally levels, you can continue with Sorcerer. And, this sorcerer can wield the Holy Avenger!

Look at the party now! Two excellent Tanks (Fighter/Battleguard, Monk/Druid), two heavy hitters (Sorcerer, Paladin/Sorcerer), a utility man (Rogue/Wizard), and a free slot! That guy can be almost anything!

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 10:02 am

for that last slot.. i would add painbearer of ilmater... or dread master of bane.. for extra healing and buffs..

neocool00 · Post by **neocool00** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 12:28 pm

[QUOTE=thenenea]1. Human Paladin - that one is supposed to be me

- two handed sword and mace
2. Dwarf Cleric - a pretty good tank and can also buff the party before battles - mace and sling probably
3. Halfling Thief - remove traps, unlock chests, scout and backstap with dual small blades - small blades and crossbow
4. Woodelf Ranger - ok, maybe not the best one but I like the idea of a pure archer and maybe get him to dual wield Scimitars

- long bow and scimitars
or
Human Cleric - here I'm not fully decided yet because a second cleric might make a big difference in tough battles - sling and mace
5. Drow Wizard - gonna get some penalties during the day but I think the bonuses worth it - sling and quarterstaff
6. Human or maybe Aasimar Sorcerer - for the situations where a single spell is needed in large quantities - sling and quarterstaff
[/QUOTE]
Ok, change second cleric to druid just to get a good mix and having a druid is very useful (I have one in my current party of three). Ditch the theif and have your Drow Wizard take one level of Rogue, that's all you really need. A Drow Wizard/Rogue with max dex & int is pretty awesome. Ranger is totally up to you. I personally don't care for them in IWD2. They were awesome in the first one (IWD), but in IWD2 I don't think they are nearly as useful. Yeah, they get dual weilding capabilites for free, but 2 levels of Fighter can give you that as well. I would consider dropping the Ranger and take a Deep Gnome Monk. They rock. Also, just because you can take 6 characters doesn't mean you have to. IMO, 6 characters require quite a bit of micro management and they don't level up as fast as a smaller party would.

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 10:46 pm

Yes neo is right... but in HoF i prefer big party.. why? well you have six chars.. so you get more HP, attacks and spells.. but when just playing normal dificulty.. 3-4 party is good. and when you get to HoF you can get 2 extra party members..