Little help with party...

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 7:33 am

I am creating new party.. i have this kind party..

#1. Paladin 2/Fighter 4/Sorcerer X

#2. Druid X

#3. Fighter 4/Sorcerer X

#4. Monk X

So would you have ideas for 2 last Chars.. i already know what would make this party quite good.. but i would like to get new ideas? I have started playing this game.. but well i could save my new party members from monsters.. so it would create some extra roleplaying aspects..

So if you have any ideas post those and fill these two slots...

#5.
&
#6.

Brynn · Post by **Brynn** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 7:54 am

I know you're not a beginner so I won't be boring you why you may need a good rogue

I guess you aren't after more useful skills, right? What about trying out a bard? That must be interesting (and hard) to play.

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 8:37 am

no not at all... bards are quite nice chars.. they get shadow summoning and and vail of banshee.. and before i forgot bards also get nice party boost spells..(done that..)

But as for rogue.. well when dualed to fighter or wizard.. then i would have quite nice char.. but since for me rogues main purpose is to disarm traps.. and since In IWD2 traps are jokes.. i feel that pointless.. but in IWD1 rogue was a must.. i still remember the horrors of wyrms cave? theet? head? how did this happen? i have forgotten name of that place.. But back to main part.. in there almost every time i tried to move forwards..

''Trap sprung''

Char #1. poisoned or disiesed.. and then snowball swarm... it was like pain in the @55... and it made me like to smash my screen.. but it was nice to have chalenge... that some areas were chalenging.. instead of just final bosses..

BTW i am open for any ideas.. except ones with rogue..(unless it is bad in theory and in game too)

Vanion · Post by **Vanion** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 10:22 pm

I would assume that you're using a good aligned party, so I guess that would be the general vein of ideas you're looking for. As for role...well, it depends on what you're after. Personally I always liked the idea of a frail, quiet cleric of Oghma who could turn the tide of a battle with a few well placed spells. They're not the most powerful domain by any stretch, but they're an interesting choice and fit nicely with a good group.

I'm not a big fan of the Fighter4/SorcX. The +4 to BAB won't be noticeable once you hit higher levels, and you won't have a great melee presence. You'll be able to churn out some nice damage at times, but that's contingent on you always being in a flanking position or at distance so as to not get torn to shreds. Still, it could be interesting.

For your last character...well, one of my favourites was always a Wild Elf pure Barbarian. Absolutely no Charisma High Dex, Strength and Constitution meant that he was awesome in light armours. With Cat's Grace got the benefit of the best leathers in the game. Awesome reflex saves so he could sprint through an area hit by a fireball or web and tear the casters to shreds.

The backstory that I had for him was that he was tortured and mutilated by a group of Uthgardt while journeying. Had his tongue ripped out and lost an eye, as well as having a good measure of the point ripped off one ear. He says nothing, growls incoherently and hits things often and well. Crack shot with a bow from his hunting days, but comfortable with melee weapons.

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 11:18 pm

As for your barbarian.. Chain of Drakhas would be better..

and i can always give to my char 15/+3 gauntlet..

yes i do need cleric.. but i prefer Dreadmaster of Bane becuse Tyrant's Dictum
(Enemy will save at 1)

But i havent tried yet cleric of Oghma..
but his/hers Domain spells does look nice.

1st: Identify, Eagle's Splendor
2nd: Charm Person, See Invisible
3rd: Find Traps, Dispel Magic
4th: Malison, Shout
5th: Power Word: Silence, Greater Command
6th: Power Word: Stun, Symbol of Fear
7th: Great Shout, Symbol of Hopelessness
8th: Power Word: Kill, Symbol of Death
9th: Executioner's Eyes, Wail of the Banshee

Perhaps i will give a try to that.. But Oghma's other benifits looks like nothing compared to Dreadmasters..

Oghma's Knowledge (+1 to Alchemy, Knowledge Arcana skills)
Identify 1/Day

When dread master has these..

Tyrant's Dictum (all saves vs. their will spells are at +1 DC)
+1 to all Bluff, Diplomacy, and Intimidate

If anyone has more ideas please tell!

Vanion · Post by **Vanion** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 2:55 am

Fair enough. You said you were after roleplay ideas, though, and there's no way you'd have a Paladin of Tyr, Ilmater or Mystra travelling with a Dreadmaster of Bane, especially in a post Time of Troubles scenario. Maybe a Stormlord of Talos, assuming that they saw the dogma of destruction as an inherent and necessary part of the cycle of balance rather than liscence to kill as they pleased and committed no overt evil, but it's all irrelevant to the game anyway, so I'll stop blathering.

In terms of balance and abilities alone, Mask is a rather interesting choice of Cleric domains, as is Talos. Lathander looks to be extremely potent and versatile with Spirit of the Flame. Helm and Selune both look very powerful at higher levels, with Aegis and Iron Body stacking up just as nicely as Elemental Legion and Prismatic Spray. While +1 to mind affecting DCs is nice, it generally won't make a lot of difference if your cleric takes greater spell focus: enchantment and your sorcerors have plenty of Malisons. That said, +1 can be the difference between life and death on some occasions, so it can't hurt.

Rogue/Sorceror or Rogue/Paladin might make an interesting combo. I found with a rogue/illusionist combo that by taking rogue at first level I was able to circumvent most traps, have decent conversation skills, and with huge charisma combined with eagle's splendour to make up for lack of skills ranks, still managed to get through the frist couple of chapters with no sweat in getting the info or extra gold I wanted.

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 3:15 am

Bravo! Realy good post!

But Draedmaster with spell penetration and spell focus.. is quite nice..

Sorcerer #1 cast's malisoon and sorcerer #2 Wail of banshee.. and same time cleric cast some maind spell..

This will end up being that there is few monsters with mind of their own but rest of those are either dead or just being headless chickens..

Vanion · Post by **Vanion** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 4:00 am

Pretty hard to stop that combo. With a powerful summon up front that's immune to death magic (like Animate Dead or Shades) you'd be able to walk out of most encounters unscathed.

Even though they're mostly dead weight in IWD, I just like having a dedicated melee character in all my groups since I tend to make characters who like going toe to toe with their enemies in all RPGs I play, single player or online.

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 4:14 am

and i tend to have spell casting ability on every char.. and more spells i have more happier i am..

Well i got bored on my new party..

And now i am planing to craete new one...

Barbarian
Bard
Cleric
Sorcerer

and adding 2 extra chars when i get to HoF..

Perhaps i will give a try with Oghma..

But i am still open for ideas..

Brynn · Post by **Brynn** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 4:29 am

I'd rather ask then giving advice, if you don't mind

Why is it good to give spellcasting abilities to all your chars? As I see it, it will only keep them back from improving in their main class - and having low level spells are not that useful, either - all in all, I think the juice sipmly doesn't worth the squeeze... Why do you stick to that? I'm curious.

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 5:35 am

Of course i will give spell casting ability if there is usefull spell that i could use.. like 2 sorcerer's other cast Malisson while other Cast Wail of banshee.. this way it saves time.. and your party.. and if in your party there is more than just 1 char that can cast decent summoning spells that will help your party too. It is just aiming for ceratin playing style..

It is just like in Diablo 2 you might save skill point so you can use those later wich will help you create good and strong character wich can kill many monsters.. and perhaps own in pvp..

So in start of game i'll use low level fightning skills to survive.. but in later game i'll use spells that will kick games butt..

And fighter with mirror image last's little bit longer.. and might have some boost spells by himself wich will tone down the number of boost spell's on other spellcasters. This way all characters have some use when playing this game.

Vanion · Post by **Vanion** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 6:04 pm

One combination which I've always rather enjoyed is Fighter 4/Bard X...made a character like this for a 3e campaign, and it worked out superbly. Because of the 4 fighter levels, you get 4 attacks per round rather early, and access to maximised damage in IWD2. The amount of skill points means that you can be successful as a scout or whatever other cross class purpose you decide, in one facet anyway.

While it has nowhere near the offensive spell capabilites of a fighter/sorceror, it benefits from good reflex saves as well as will, songs for instabuff (useable in all armour), good heal and buff spells, and a few spells that can turn the tide of a battle (sleep, chromatic orb, Wail of the Banshee at really high levels). The mid range BAB combined with 4 fighter levels means that it's effective in melee or at range depending on how you structure the stats. If you take off your armour to buff before battle, then put it back on, you'll have no trouble benefitting from the best full plate in the game and have no real need for dexterity, but there's always the Chain of Drakkas, so it can't hurt to set it up with some handy.

As well as that, since Bards get access to the Use Magic Device skill, it's entirely possible that this character could end up wielding the holy avenger. I'm not sure on the rulings as IWD goes, but in 3e and 3.5 DnD, with a high enough rank in the skill you can use an item that has a class and/or alignment requirement. If you made a drow pure class bard or a human fighter/bard, you could do some real damage and benefit from some nifty tricks.

Heidrek · Post by **Heidrek** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 2:17 pm

Unfortunately the Use Magic Item skill only applies to Scrolls in IWD2

I'd really recommend a Bard/Rogue/Fighter. I'd take fighter 1st for the extra feat and all the weapon prof. (starting Feats Rapid Shot, Power Attack, Cleave), then Bard (Lingering Song) for a while and then a copuple of Rogue levels for Snaek attacks and Evasion. Final build roughly Bard17/Rogue7/Fighter6. This lets your Bard have Shades, Great Shout and Mass Haste at 6th level. He'll be an Archer for a while, then end up Dual Wielding with Mirror Images etc. He can lead the party and Shoot at approaching foes then Great Shout them once they get close for a guaranteed stun then Dual Wield at them while stunned. As a nice bonus, you'll get your sneak attack bonus on a stunned opponent!

I'd also advise a Cleric, perhaps multiclassing later into Fighter or Barb, or Paladin if you choose Painbearer. Can't live without Greater Command, Recitation, Holy Word, Heal and Symbol: Hoplessness. They have saved me too many times.

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 5:59 am

[QUOTE=Heidrek]Unfortunately the Use Magic Item skill only applies to Scrolls in IWD2

[/QUOTE]
WRONG!

After playing with my new party.. and putting some points to Use Magic Skill and i am now in kuldahar i bought Every god ring from nathaniel and i realised that i could use some crappy druidic talisman with my bard so i ques i can use holy avenger too..

Personally i just love my new party... game has been quite easy with it..
Now it is something like this...

Barbarian level 16. going to give wizard levels so i can cast mirror image.. +4 fighter levels..

Cleric (oghma) 16. +4 fighter levels in somepart in this game..

Bard 12/figher 4. perhaps just spenting more levels on Bard..

Sorcerer 17. +4 fighter levels in mid HoF..

And as for new HoF chars..

Rogue 3/figheter 4/wizard X

&

Druid or extra cleric..

BTW.. does anyone know where you can find this item?

GEITHMAN'S IRON-RINGED WAGER

This magical hoop looks like it belongs around a barrel, and chances are, it probably once was. There are numerous tales (most of them false) about the hoop's origins, but the most common tale says that the hoop was born in the Elfsong Tavern in Baldur's Gate, and that it was the result of an angry wager between two men, one, a quiet wild mage by the name of Dreisbach, and the other, a passionate stevedore by the name of Geithman. Geithman claimed that magic was no substitute for raw strength and determination, and when Dreisbach begged to differ, the bet was decided: whoever could load the most barrels into one of the port warehouses from dawn to dusk would be declared the winner.

According to the tale, Dreisbach fashioned the hoop in a single night, and when he arrived at the warehouse the next morning, he drew forth the hoop and spun it on the ground - with every spin, a barrel would suddenly appear in the warehouse. Dreisbach spun the hoop for an hour, until hundreds of barrels were stacked up in the warehouse at a height several lengths of a man, so much so that Dreisbach could no longer be seen behind the walls of barrels. Geithman could not compete with the summoned barrels, and he was about to concede the contest in disgust, when Dreisbach suddenly let out a cry, and there was a clang as the iron hoop clattered to the ground. When Geithman and the onlookers navigated the maze of barrels to the space where Dreisbach had been standing, there was no trace of the mage. Only the hoop remained, lying innocently on the floor.

None of those gathered to watch the outcome of the bet dared to touch the hoop. While Dreisbach was declared the winner, every man gathered there that day conceded that Tymora had smiled upon Geithman instead. The warehouse was quickly locked up, and the men quickly retreated to the Elfsong to talk of other things.

Where the barrels the hoop summons come from is unknown, but it is recommended that the user exercise caution in the summoning... or else the barrels will have their vengeance.

STATISTICS:

Special: Summons a keg once per day. The kegs frequently contain something of value.
Weight: 3 lb.

Vanion · Post by **Vanion** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 6:47 am

Very interesting. It will be a couple of months before I can fire up the game (PC and location issues), but I'll have to test an IWD bard when I do (never used a bard or druid in IWD so far).

My guess is that the reason most people don't realise it affects magic items is because the DCs can get rather high. "Impersonating" a specific class is something like a DC 15 check, a specific alignment or race is DC 20, two or more is DC 25+, off the top of my head, anyway. I'd have to check the PHB to be certain.

By the time you get access to some great charisma enchancing items and eagle's splendour, your maxed out UMD ranks should be able to make these sort of prereqs at a reasonable level. Gives you some rather interesting options, especially if you're a good character who uses an evil specific item, or vice versa.

As it is, a succesful spellcasting check for UMD use is 25 + spell level, so in order to reliably cast a 2nd level scroll you need a check of 26! The skill seems way more useful for using specific items and the odd wand, than for wasting all that cash on a scroll you could sell IMO, especially when a failure just might blow up in your face.

Vanion · Post by **Vanion** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 6:55 am

Sorry, here we go with the proper data. Found a good SRD...

Decipher a written spell = 25 + Spell Level
Emulate class = 20
Emulate race = 25
Emulate alignment = 30

Pretty high DCs. Still, considering how powerful the skill can be when it becomes reliable, that's a good thing balance wise.

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:25 am

Well... you sure know about D&D rules.. but in english please?

And as for that item it creates kegs.. 3 difreant types...

type #1. about 10000 XP when you kill it..
type #2. about 300 XP when you kill it..
type #3. some magic item/scroll/jewerly or all of them.. or just nothing..

Brynn · Post by **Brynn** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:31 am

Sounds good - still no info about it's location?

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:34 am

I have no idea where to find it.. and as far as i know there is no info about it in Gambanshee... But that item is real.. found that in DaleKeeper 2.. (trying some new ideas for class duals..)

But that keg is immune to Slashing.. blugedoing damage... and it has 15 res. with piersing.. but malisson and finger of death works nice..

Heidrek · Post by **Heidrek** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:10 pm

[QUOTE=Vanion]Sorry, here we go with the proper data. Found a good SRD...

Decipher a written spell = 25 + Spell Level
Emulate class = 20
Emulate race = 25
Emulate alignment = 30

Pretty high DCs. Still, considering how powerful the skill can be when it becomes reliable, that's a good thing balance wise.[/QUOTE]

Now I'm getting excited. I have a Bard/Rogue that's about ready to Level up twice so I'm putting all the skill points into UMD! I've already got some points in it, and just picked up Light of Cera Sumat (those lost followers are mucho tough, one of them wwas hitting me for 150 damage at a time!). Reading the description of Light of CS, it shows it is only usable by Paladins, but doesn't require Lawful Good alignment, so it should have a DC of 20 right? I'd love to Dual Wield Cera Sumat in one hand and Bhaals Fire in the other for the ultimate in contradiction!

If correct this ability would make the Bard and Rogue classes much better! So far I've only used that skill with scrolls and wands as it says in the skill description, but getting access to class specific items would be fantastic!