gaming jobs

Lowkei · Post by **Lowkei** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 4:47 pm

Hay guys, i just left school an am know workin my way to university to learn to desighn computer games so i can have the best job ever, but people think im wasting my life because they all say it's a small industry. well i know it isn't and i dun care if it was because i am a hardcore gamer dam it and i wanna job in the computer game industry.Who thinks people who don't play computer games are idiots?

Paranitis · Post by **Paranitis** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 4:58 pm

That's a really ignorant question you are asking.

People who don't play computer games are NOT idiots, they just have a belief that they have something better to do with their time.

People who DO play computer games are NOT idiots, because they think they have nothing better to do with their time.

Calling someone an idiot for not believing in what you believe is just extremely ignorant and I hope you die by being stabbed in the eye with a sharp carrot filled with flesh eatting bacteria.

C Elegans · Post by **C Elegans** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 5:06 pm

When it comes to education and choosing a profession, I think everybody should pursuit what they feel they want and have a passion for. Studies of college and university students actually show that students do better when they choose education from their own wishes, rather than parental or other social pressure or advice from educational consultants.

Personally, I think designing and making computer games is as tedious as any programming work and not at all associated with the fun of playing games, but if you like programming, it might be a good idea to look for jobs in the gaming industry.

And, no I don't think people who don't play computer games are idiots, playing computer games is not correlated to intelligence, reason, talent or any other traits that makes people less idiotic.

Nippy · Post by **Nippy** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 5:41 pm

The gaming industry is a small, tight-knit community. Generally any programmer with a solid degree coming from a good software (development) house will not struggle for work, however, don't believe that being a games designer is playing games all day and cracking great fun, it sure as hell isn't.

I personally know a few code monkies - guys who are working for Codemasters and Elixir Studios - both relatively big software houses in the UK. These guys don't play games all day, nor do they have an easy job. The modern day pressures of tight projects and small time scales means that now games production is one of the most stressful coding jobs around.

More power to your elbow if you love doing the hard work behind games - I like people like you! You make my games. =) But beware, if you want to work outside of the games industry and work on more generic coding applications, you may well struggle to find companies willing to dicuss the potential of working with them. My advice is to not just look at Computer Games Development as a Degree course - that may well limit your potential opportunites, consider a general Software Engineering degree or Computer Science as potential alternatives - that way, if you find you don't enjoy games development as much, it will give you the opportunity to look at other areas of development and will more than likely give you an excellent grounding in other languages and SDK's. The reading of another degree will also not limit your potential employment in the industry. You don't need to have a Games development related degree to work in the industry - they look at software engineers all the time - I know, I've recruited in the industry. =)

fable · Post by **fable** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 6:12 pm

Games development is not a well-paying industry. There are too many people with degrees who thought "Wow, this oughta be fun!" applying for such jobs, and the industry is in a state of downsizing and consolidation. It seems that every month, some game developer closes its doors. More and more games are coming in from Europe and Asia, too, via US publishers, since its cheaper to higher good labor overseas. Development companies that do well, as a result, are frequently outside the US (Bioware in Canada, for example) or paying very low wages (Bethesda Softworks).

Who thinks people who don't play computer games are idiots?

Not I. Your question has echoes going back through time, when people wrote articles suggesting that those who didn't watch television were antisocial jerks, or those who didn't listen to radio were morons who wore glasses, or those who didn't attend the local dance deserved to be assaulted and thrown in the local river. Just because you enjoy something doesn't mean everybody else should; and the idea of demeaning others for lacking your taste--or mine--isn't going to win the kind of friends you necessarily want.

Lowkei · Post by **Lowkei** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 4:06 am

yeah but

Look i know people who don't play computer games arn't actully idiots that was just a joke, but i know you guys must all love playing computer games because your all members of this forum, but if it wasn't for people thinkging computer games are a waste of time then the gaming industry woul be a lot bigger. Remember if it wasn't for game desighners you wouldn't have these games to play and who cares if it isn't about playing games all day you do that when you get home. The gamin industry is one of the worlds most fastest expanding industry out there. soon computer games will wipe out sports because computers are the futre. I mean seriously isn't there anyone who is a hardcore gamer like me who dreams of having a job in the gaming industry because you love playing computer games and always will, because i will be gaming well in to my 90's. Happy gaming anyway.
P.S. it's not that i think people who don't play computer games are sad it's just that they bad mouth me and others for doing it. i don't care if they play them or not but leave us to do what we want. If you guys don't think programming is the way to go then you must know sothing in the industry that well paid and plenty of jobs. what about games tester, or games journalism because i love reading my favorite magazine (gamesmaster) every month and i think i would enjoy writing bout games. Come on guys i need more info and tips i don't wanna throuh my life down the toilet but i still wanna have a job i love. I mean halo 2 is coming out soon and bunjie will make millions on just this one game, you only live once and the world is stressful enough as it is and computer games should be played by all to relax people. there fun and help you 4get bout life and stuff.

Rookierookie · Post by **Rookierookie** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 4:13 am

http://www.csmonitor.com/2003/0829/p01s04-ussc.html

Rather interesting link. I used it in another forum bashing Bible studies

Vicsun · Post by **Vicsun** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 4:36 am

but if it wasn't for people thinkging computer games are a waste of time then the gaming industry woul be a lot bigger.
And there were less people thinking sports are a waste of time, the sports industry would be bigger. If there were less people who thought McDonalds' is disgusting, McDonalds' would be bigger. What's your point? Some people like playing computer games and others either don't find it interesting or can't find the time.

The gamin industry is one of the worlds most fastest expanding industry out there.
lol most fastest lol
On a serious note, I was under the impression it was in decline, but I have no facts to back this up. It was more of an impression based on whole teams working on games being sacked.

soon computer games will wipe out sports because computers are the futre.
You have to compare apples to apples. What you are comparing isn't even apples to oranges, what you are comparing is apples to gravity. When apples were discovered gravity didn't cease to function, because the two are not related in any way. Yes, I just made an analogy between apples and computer games, and sports and gravity.

I mean seriously isn't there anyone who is a hardcore gamer like me who dreams of having a job in the gaming industry because you love playing computer games and always will
I enjoy playing games. That doesn't mean I have to particularly enjoy writing code. Or even if I do, it doesn't mean I have to think it's a feasable carrier choice.

because i will be gaming well in to my 90's.
You probably won't

Paranitis · Post by **Paranitis** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 4:47 am

I could easily be a game tester or a game reviewer..because I can look at things without any expectations. I could play a Harry Potter game and look at it as though I were 10 years old, I can play Baldur's Gate, or Dark Alliance and give a completely unbiased view on both without having to talk about either of them in comparison, OR each companies past works.

I judge each and every game as it's own seperate entity without having to fall back on previous dealings.

But the problem is..I tend to say WAY more than is needed, and I am not exactly the besterest dude when it deals with formulating sentence structure.

I could also do the exact same thing with movies as well, but still..have the same limitations.

Rookierookie · Post by **Rookierookie** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 5:03 am

If I ever get to work for the gaming industry I will probably be doing concepts, scripts, storylines, dialogues and the likes. I'm not exactly a fan of coding.

Nippy · Post by **Nippy** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 6:03 am

[QUOTE=Lowkei]Look i know people who don't play computer games arn't actully idiots that was just a joke, but i know you guys must all love playing computer games because your all members of this forum, but if it wasn't for people thinkging computer games are a waste of time then the gaming industry woul be a lot bigger. Remember if it wasn't for game desighners you wouldn't have these games to play and who cares if it isn't about playing games all day you do that when you get home. The gamin industry is one of the worlds most fastest expanding industry out there. soon computer games will wipe out sports because computers are the futre. I mean seriously isn't there anyone who is a hardcore gamer like me who dreams of having a job in the gaming industry because you love playing computer games and always will, because i will be gaming well in to my 90's. Happy gaming anyway.
P.S. it's not that i think people who don't play computer games are sad it's just that they bad mouth me and others for doing it. i don't care if they play them or not but leave us to do what we want. If you guys don't think programming is the way to go then you must know sothing in the industry that well paid and plenty of jobs. what about games tester, or games journalism because i love reading my favorite magazine (gamesmaster) every month and i think i would enjoy writing bout games. Come on guys i need more info and tips i don't wanna throuh my life down the toilet but i still wanna have a job i love. I mean halo 2 is coming out soon and bunjie will make millions on just this one game, you only live once and the world is stressful enough as it is and computer games should be played by all to relax people. there fun and help you 4get bout life and stuff.[/QUOTE]

OK mate, a couple of quick questions for you if I can.

How far along are you in terms of your schooling?

and

How strong are your maths skills?

The reason I ask the first is related to the second; if you were wanting to actually work on the coding side, you need really good maths and I mean real strong.

Don't feel that coding is your only route into what is a declining industry, people are getting laid off because of exactly what Fable said - cheap labour elsewhere, and games studio's in places like Russia are entering a renaissance - they truly love the industry there and work cheap 'cos of it.

Vicsun · Post by **Vicsun** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 6:10 am

[QUOTE=Nippy]OK mate, a couple of quick questions for you if I can.

How far along are you in terms of your schooling?

and

How strong are your maths skills?

and

Are you prepared to work long hours in a cubicle for a laughably low wage while knowing your job will be soon outsourced to a place where labor is cheaper?
[/quote]
fixed in interest of reality.

Nippy · Post by **Nippy** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 6:18 am

[QUOTE=Vicsun]fixed in interest of reality.[/QUOTE]

Knew I forgot something...

fable · Post by **fable** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 9:31 am

The gamin industry is one of the worlds most fastest expanding industry out there.

Lowkei, are you even reading what we're writing? Better still, are you checking the statistics for the gaming industry, before making such statements? Because every statistical result I've seen shows that it's in decline. Major companies are laying off workers. Smaller gaming companies are shutting down. Contracts to do new games are going overseas at an unprecedented rate, because the cost of development is much cheaper for non-US game developers. You would not be entering a burgeoning field if you became a game coder in the US. You would be entering a field that is seriously shrinking, at an alarming rate.

I'm not suggesting you focus your attention elsewhere for a future job. I am only urging you to consider the facts, instead of repeating the rhetoric of public relations firms. You're going to be making some choices that will seriously affect your life path in the near future. Make those choices on an informed basis, rather than shooting from the hip. It can only help.

Xenos1 · Post by **Xenos1** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 10:11 am

Wicked and ?

Just wanted to say I also think game designing would be kinda fun though id probally like being a tester more, I dont think people that dont are idiots though I really hate people who call others " Vidiot's " or other such things, I was also a bit curious people seem to always mention the need to be strong in math for computer programming and such and I have to ask why ? I mean computers are essentialy powerful caculators and when I learned C and C++ I never really needed all that much in the way of mathmatical skills this is mostly due to my education only including math 11, though i do have physics 12 which i honestly find far more useful.

Heh sorry its so long but that questions been on my mind for awhile now

Nippy · Post by **Nippy** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 10:41 am

@ Xenos, generally the need for strong maths lies not on just the actual coding skills, its more focused on the fact that any seriously good game engine will have good physics behind it - thats where your maths skills are required.

Xandax · Post by **Xandax** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 11:34 am

[QUOTE=Xenos1]Just wanted to say I also think game designing would be kinda fun though id probally like being a tester more, I dont think people that dont are idiots though I really hate people who call others " Vidiot's " or other such things, I was also a bit curious people seem to always mention the need to be strong in math for computer programming and such and I have to ask why ? I mean computers are essentialy powerful caculators and when I learned C and C++ I never really needed all that much in the way of mathmatical skills this is mostly due to my education only including math 11, though i do have physics 12 which i honestly find far more useful.

Heh sorry its so long but that questions been on my mind for awhile now

[/QUOTE]

Good math skills are needed if you want to code effectively.
If you code an engine you need to - as Nippy says - also code physics, and much of the algorithmes has to be optimzied as well, so a lot of time will be used to weed out leaks, slow iterations and loops and similar.
As good a calculater as the computer is, it still has its limits in optimizing codes becuase it mainly only calculates what you tell it to calculate. So if you use substandard code, it will calculate substandard code which can lead to serious timesinks in the code and thus in the execution of the application.

Now good mathskills dosen't make a good programmer, and you can be a good programmer without being a mathwiz. However - the two are linked in manners that one make the other easier, but a lot of experience with coding is just as valurable as simply being good at math.
I've known many math-people that couldn't code "Hello World" (well, exageration), but I also know programmers that weren't a wizard in math (myself inclusive

).

However - there are many other things to do in gamedevelopments then simply coding.

Vicsun · Post by **Vicsun** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 11:40 am

There seem to be many people who say they want to become 'game testers'. I was under the impression that testing games was not a paid job - as a matter of fact getting into betas where you get to test games of other companies without getting paid is quite difficult due to the swarm of people who want to be the first one to experience the game.

I would think that pre-beta testing is done by the programmers themselves. Am I wrong?

fable · Post by **fable** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 11:45 am

[QUOTE=Vicsun]There seem to be many people who say they want to become 'game testers'. I was under the impression that testing games was not a paid job - as a matter of fact getting into betas where you get to test games of other companies without getting paid is quite difficult due to the swarm of people who want to be the first one to experience the game.

I would think that pre-beta testing is done by the programmers themselves. Am I wrong?[/QUOTE]

No, you're right. There are innumerable players who will fall over themselves and neglect real life in order to play test games, and they do so. There are a very few playtesting houses which typically only test for bugs, and their workers are not game players--they're more like fault testers, engaged in any other industry.

Paranitis · Post by **Paranitis** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 7:20 pm

I would be one that would do the bug testing and seeing if everything works properly. I will open a door 150 times just to see that the handle stays on the door and the door opens like a real door and all that.

Most people (90%+) that sign up for Beta Testing do it just to be the first to play the game..and they take the testing part as a secondary reason, or even not a reason at all. They beat the part of the game they got and say 'yeah, it's good' and that's it. No comments on how stuff works, timing on other stuff, etc.

So in reality..'beta testers' and 'game testers' are in different ballparks.