[Possibly Spoilers] 2.2 Patch bug for malkavians?

Chiche · Post by **Chiche** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 6:11 pm

I have both the official 1.2 patch installed and the 2.2 unofficial game patch installed.

My problem is this: I come back after killing the thugs at the diner that Jeanette sent at me (or Therese for that matter). I can choose to side with either Jeanette or Therese but I can not, even with 4 points or higher in persuasion, get them to make peace with each other for the full six points in experience.

My character is a Malkavian but I seem to be getting a different chain of responses than those listed for the official patch. The first time I get a blue persuasion alternative but from there on no other one appears. The very last alternatives I get are three different ones, one clearly siding with Jeanette, one clearly siding with Therese and one asking them to give me the boomstick. The first one makes me side with Jeanette of course, but then the last two BOTH make me side with Therese.

Has anyone else experienced this problem? Does anyone have a solution? Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

mr_sir · Post by **mr_sir** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 7:19 pm

ideally you need persuasion of 6. as for the blue options, once you have chosen one it gives you new choices but they are not always highlighted as blue - it depends on your persuasion level - so you just have to try and figure out which is the right one.

Anaximander · Post by **Anaximander** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 1:38 am

This actually isn't a bug, it's a fix. If you look at the original dialogue file, you'll see that there are other conditions that must be met in order to reconcile Jeanette and Therese. Previous to the 2.2 patch, these conditions were ignored. The game was erroneously checking only the Persuasion 4 condition.

With the dialogue now working as it was originally supposed to, you have to appease both sisters to reconcile them. To do this, you must be polite to Therese and you must either give Jeanette the Ocean House pendant, or use seduction on her.

As of the 2.2 patch, characters without a seduction feat of at least 2 who give the pendant to Therese will not be able to reconcile her with Jeanette.

Does anyone have a solution?

Yes, and a simple one. Since all characters, with the obvious exception of the Nosferatu, start with 1 point in appearance, spend 3 xp on a single point of subterfuge before your first encounter with Jeanette. This will bring your Seduction feat up to 2, which is all you need to seduce her. By using the seduction dialogue options on her, you'll make her happy enough to unlock the reconciliation dialogue options later on.

cyberpaddy66 · Post by **cyberpaddy66** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 4:51 pm

I installed the 2.2 patch, started playing Malkavien (funniest vamp IMHO) and had 3 seduction before I met Jeanette (where upon I tried seducing my way into her knickers), I gave the Amulet to Therese (thus shutting her up) and had a persuation of 6 by the time they started to fight!

The only blue option I got was the 1st one, I was NOT given any options to recconcile them so I ended up chooseing to save the sexy one :laugh:

I think this fix is bogus as it just STOPS you getting the extra XP for keeping them both alive! I spent almost 3 hours trying every combination and even back tracking to previous saves - I must be one of 2 things - either I'm a total geek or I don't have a social life (these options are not exclusive and may be combined for TOTAL GEEKINESS :laugh

Anaximander · Post by **Anaximander** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 5:58 pm

cyberpaddy66 wrote:I installed the 2.2 patch, started playing Malkavien (funniest vamp IMHO) and had 3 seduction before I met Jeanette (where upon I tried seducing my way into her knickers), I gave the Amulet to Therese (thus shutting her up) and had a persuation of 6 by the time they started to fight!

The only blue option I got was the 1st one, I was NOT given any options to recconcile them so I ended up chooseing to save the sexy one :laugh:

Aside from giving Therese the amulet, how did you handle the dialogue options with her? If you can, load up a save game right before the dialogue where you either reconcile the sisters or kill one of them. Open the cheat console and enter the following command:

G.Therese_Seduce >= 4

The the result is 0, then you weren't nice enough to Therese to reconcile them.

I think this fix is bogus as it just STOPS you getting the extra XP for keeping them both alive!

No, it doesn't. I have successfully reconciled Jeanette and Therese many times since installing the 2.2 patch. You just have to know what each one wants to hear.

Update: Just to verify that everything is indeed working correctly I started a new game as a Malkavian. I used seduction on Jeanette and gave Therese the Ocean House pendant. I was able to reconcile them.

cyberpaddy66 · Post by **cyberpaddy66** » Fri May 05, 2006 8:19 am

[QUOTE=Anaximander]Aside from giving Therese the amulet, how did you handle the dialogue options with her? If you can, load up a save game right before the dialogue where you either reconcile the sisters or kill one of them. Open the cheat console and enter the following command:

G.Therese_Seduce >= 4

The the result is 0, then you weren't nice enough to Therese to reconcile them.

No, it doesn't. I have successfully reconciled Jeanette and Therese many times since installing the 2.2 patch. You just have to know what each one wants to hear.

Update: Just to verify that everything is indeed working correctly I started a new game as a Malkavian. I used seduction on Jeanette and gave Therese the Ocean House pendant. I was able to reconcile them.[/QUOTE]

Just to clarify my thoughts on this I went back to a save just prior to the confrontation, with any other character and a persuade of 5 I can always reconsile them. The only persuade line I had was the 1st dialog choice, with a persuade of 6 I wasn't given any other persuade options in the entire scene.

I tried siding with each one in turn, starting with Therese 1st and then starting with Jeanette 1st. I believe I tried all posssible options but as I don't generally cheat (A few hints and tips from here don't count as cheating in my book as I finished the entire game on 1.2 before I even visited any forums

) I don't have access to the console so I can't tell if I was nice enough or not

and I deffinatly didn't piss off either one as far as previous dialogs are concerened, I'll just too nice for my own vamps good :laugh:

Anaximander · Post by **Anaximander** » Sat May 06, 2006 5:03 pm

Having persuasion greater than 4 doesn't make a difference in whether or not you can reconcile them. It all depends on your dialogue choices with Therese and Jeanette.

Here's the condition the game is checking, taken directly from the tourette.dlg file, as modified bythe 2.2 patch:

Persuasion 4 & (G.Therese_Seduce >= 4 and G.Jeanette_Seduce >= 4)

Posting the exact dialogue options for each sister that increase the G.Therese_Seduce and G.Jeanette_Seduce variables would be pretty tedious, but here's a general guide:

In your first dialogue with Therese, she'll apologize for Jeanette's crassness. What she really wants to hear is that you didn't like Jeanette either, so tell her you're glad Jeanette is gone (Malkavian equivilant is something like "I could stomach her oozings no longer"). After that, just be as polite and flattering as possible.

When speaking with Jeanette, be playful and seductive. It only takes a seduction of 2 to use seduction lines on her, so buy a point of subterfuge and seduce her to make her really like you. If you give her the Ocean House amulet, she'll ask you what you think of Therese. The response she really likes to hear is "I don't like her type at all."

On a side note, I found the names they chose for these variables interesting. G.Jeanette_Seduce makes sense, as you can actually seduce her. But G.Therese_Seduce? I'm curious about that one. I wonder if they originally planned an option to seduce Therese, but decided against it and just left the variable name unchanged. Or maybe they just couldn't think of a better name for it....

Anaximander · Post by **Anaximander** » Tue May 23, 2006 8:35 pm

The 2.3 patch has tweaked the reconciliation of Jeanette and Therese a bit more. In 2.3, our unofficial patcher removed the seduction feat requirement from the following dialogue option:

Jeanette: Really? Do I often pogo stick through your thoughts wearing nothing but a smile? Be honest... Or don't
PC: All the time Jeanette. What do I do in yours?

The result is that now any character can reconcile the two without spending xp to bump seduction up to 2. This is especially helpful for Nosferatu players who want to get maximum xp.

Mike89 · Post by **Mike89** » Thu Jun 15, 2006 1:16 pm

I also do not like the changes for the 2.3 patch regarding the Jeannette/Therese rivalry. I also could not get them to reconcile. It was either one kill the other. During the dialog, I only had two choices each time, each one strongly favoring the other and no in between. No matter how I answered, it came down to the final answer, either have Jeannette grab the gun or tell Therese to finish her off. Way dumbed down from the original dialog choices. I was nice to both previously but I guess I must have missed answering right (and it's not even a matter of being right, it's a matter of answering the way the patch says you have to) on one question somewhere before. I do not like this because by that time, it's too late. There should be more leeway to be able to get them to reconcile, having a choice in that final dialog between them to make it come out the way you want. I liked the way it was originally cause I felt I had more choice/control in this matter (and could make it come out all 3 ways). What this did was take control away from the player because one could play the whole game and not even realize there was even a choice for them to reconcile because of answering one specific question wrong, way before the event even occurred, which no one is going to see the significance to at that time. Not everyone reads the forum on the game BEFORE they play it. I just think this was a mistake.

Acleacius · Post by **Acleacius** » Thu Jun 15, 2006 6:21 pm

Wesp5 said he had Robinhood70 change/fix it in the current version 2.4, when I tested it I play it as they changed it in 2.3 so I didn't check to see if it was fixed.
I will replay it as I need to recheck the Gallery anyway in chapter 1, when I finish testing 2.4, currently just startig Chinatown, so it maybe tomorrow.