North Korea fire Two Missiles

ch85us2001 · Post by **ch85us2001** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 2:46 pm

[url="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060704/ap_on_re_as/nkorea_missile"]http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060704/ap_on_re_as/nkorea_missile[/url]

Well, this'll be the War I'll be fighting in a few years, likely.

dragon wench · Post by **dragon wench** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 2:53 pm

*shudders*
Ominous news indeed... Not that the subject hasn't been in the news already.. but.... further confirmation of what seems to be an escalating situation...

ch85us2001 · Post by **ch85us2001** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 2:54 pm

If and when the US gets in a war with North Korea, I wouldn't put it beyond doubt for the draft to be reinstated.

I'd probably just go sign up, if that happened.

But, at least it was only a SCUD, and not a ICBM. That's still to close for comfort, however.

fable · Post by **fable** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 3:01 pm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/5148648.stm

They give more details, and mention only one missile as confirmed.

TonyMontana1638 · Post by **TonyMontana1638** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 3:05 pm

One, two... I don't think the number really matters that much, it's still disconcerting.

ch85us2001 · Post by **ch85us2001** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 3:16 pm

[QUOTE=fable]http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/5148648.stm

They give more details, and mention only one missile as confirmed.[/QUOTE]
According to that, it was an ICBM (Inter Contenintal Ballistic Missile)

Oh boy.

fable · Post by **fable** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 3:41 pm

I said here back in 2002 that Dubya wasn't serious about his WMD nonsense over Iraq, because the logical nation to invade (if that's what he wanted) was North Korea. It truly is a global threat, but, alas, it has no oil--so no sources of revenue for all those companies swelling the stock portfolios of Cheney, Rumsfeld, etc.

Fiona · Post by **Fiona** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 4:04 pm

So what is new?

Who's Next?

One of the big news items of the past year concerned the fact that China, which we call Red China, exploded a nuclear bomb, which we called a device. Then Indonesia announced that it was gonna have one soon, and proliferation became the word of the day. Here's a song about that.

First we got the bomb and that was good,
'Cause we love peace and motherhood.
Then Russia got the bomb, but that's O.K.,
'Cause the balance of power's maintained that way!
Who's next?

France got the bomb, but don't you grieve,
'Cause they're on our side (I believe).
China got the bomb, but have no fears;
They can't wipe us out for at least five years!*
Who's next?

Then Indonesia claimed that they
Were gonna get one any day.
South Africa wants two, that's right:
One for the black and one for the white!**
Who's next?

Egypt's gonna get one, too,
Just to use on you know who.
So Israel's getting tense,
Wants one in self defense.
"The Lord's our shepherd," says the psalm,
But just in case, we better get a bomb!
Who's next?

Luxembourg is next to go
And, who knows, maybe Monaco.
We'll try to stay serene and calm
When Alabama gets the bomb!
Who's next, who's next, who's next?
Who's next?

fable · Post by **fable** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 4:13 pm

Tom Lehrer is a classic.

Too bad all our nations are led by power-hungry, unimaginative imbeciles.

Lestat · Post by **Lestat** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 4:18 pm

[QUOTE=fable]Tom Lehrer is a classic.

Too bad all our nations are led by power-hungry, unimaginative imbeciles.

[/QUOTE]
Better than being led by power-hungry imaginative intelligent people *shudders*

Apart from that I think it is one more little step in an intrecate dance that involves China, the Koreas, Japan, the US and Russia (and at one removed Taiwan, and at two removed SE Asia), rather than something we should be extraordinarily worried about. It is not a good development, but it is not as if this comes as a surprise.

Luis Antonio · Post by **Luis Antonio** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 6:55 pm

[QUOTE=ch85us2001]
Well, this'll be the War I'll be fighting in a few years, likely.

[/QUOTE]

Very bad news for you.

I dont know where this is going, but I really want this not to happen. It wont lead the world anywhere. And if Bush werent such an agressive dope, I guess things would be far more calm nowadays.

Well, my president is more worried with the world cup, I guesses.

ch85us2001 · Post by **ch85us2001** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 8:12 pm

I wonder why they launched them near the same time as lift off for Space Shuttle Discovery? Just as an act of defiance? Or something more sinister? (cant think of anything right now)

@ Luis: I really don't want the war to happen either, but if it's a decision between that and having my family and friends proliferated, I'd rather go over there and kick some butt.

On a related note, I wonder if NK has any MiGs left over? They would be way out of date if they did, however.

Ashen · Post by **Ashen** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 1:33 am

[QUOTE=ch85us2001]
On a related note, I wonder if NK has any MiGs left over? They would be way out of date if they did, however.[/QUOTE]

Yes, as far as I know. They have MiGs - 17, 19, 21, 23 and 29, the 29s (about 20 of them) being their best ones. A little out of date really when it comes to the top of the line fighter planes these days in both Russia and the US but that is a great machine nonetheless, and they are in decent shape I believe.

Honestly, I doubt that the US will ever fight a war with N.Korea. Simply put their army is too big of a piece to swollow. They'd choke, big time. This is not Iraq.

Luis Antonio · Post by **Luis Antonio** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 6:20 am

[QUOTE=ch85us2001]
@ Luis: I really don't want the war to happen either, but if it's a decision between that and having my family and friends proliferated, I'd rather go over there and kick some butt.
[/QUOTE]

Then you better try some insurance first: Dont vote on war-totting idiots.

Our president is a peacefull drunkard, and that's the only point I think he's better than Bush, and that's enough for me to hate Bush more than I hate him

Honestly, with this war issue, I dont know how this guy got re-elected. Of course it could have been the Lord of Sleep Kerry. But then... the world would be better with a sleeping beauty than with the lord of doom.

Oh well...

ch85us2001 · Post by **ch85us2001** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 6:24 am

Well, you try and hurt my daddy, and I'll hurt you back.

I would take Bush over H. Clinton any day. But I really wanna see McCain run.

@ Ashen: It'll probably be a few airstrikes and SF teams, if anything, hopefully. If not, we'll get stuck there for another fifteen years, more than likely.

And now there saying seven missiles have been launched.

dragon wench · Post by **dragon wench** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 8:41 am

[QUOTE=ch85us2001]
And now there saying seven missiles have been launched.[/QUOTE]
Here's more information:

N. Korea answers protests with another missile
Pyongyang intensifies international furor

JOSEPH COLEMAN

Associated Press

Seoul — North Korea test-fired at least its seventh missile Wednesday, South Korean officials said, intensifying the furor ignited when the reclusive regime defied international protests by launching a long-range missile and at least five shorter-range rockets earlier in the day.

An official at the South Korea Joint Chiefs of Staff confirmed that North Korea had tested a seventh missile that was either short- or medium-range. The official, who spoke on condition of anonymity citing agency rules, had no additional details.

Japan's Kyodo News agency reported that the missile landed six minutes after launch, but did not say where. The chief of Russia's general staff said that Russian tracking systems showed that Pyongyang may have launched up to 10 missiles during the day, the Interfax news agency reported.

The missiles, all of which apparently fell harmlessly into the Sea of Japan, triggered international condemnation, the convening of an emergency meeting of the United Nations Security Council and calls in Tokyo for economic sanctions against the impoverished communist regime.

North Korea remained defiant, with one official arguing that the country had the right to such launches. The tests and the impertinent North Korean attitude sparked fears that further firings could follow.

U.S. officials said North Korea fired a long-range Taepodong-2 early in the day, but that it failed shortly after takeoff, calling into question the technological capability of North Korea's feared ballistic missile program. Pyongyang last fired a long-range missile in 1998.

The bold firings came under close international scrutiny of the North's missile launch facilities. The North American Aerospace Defence Command monitored the launches as they progressed but soon determined they were not a threat to the United States, a spokesman said.

Some feared more firings. Pyongyang could test additional missiles soon despite the international furor over Wednesday's launches, Australian Foreign Minister Alexander Downer said after making a protest via telephone to North Korea's ambassador to Canberra, Chon Jae Hong.

"We think they probably do intend to launch more missiles in the next day or two," Mr. Downer told reporters, without explaining if the possibility of more tests came up in his talk with Mr. Chon.

South Korea, separated from the North by the world's most heavily armed border, said the test launches would further deepen its neighbour's international isolation, sour public opinion in the South toward Pyongyang and hurt efforts to control weapons of mass destruction.

The tests, which came as the United States celebrated its Independence Day holiday and launched the space shuttle Discovery from Cape Canaveral, Florida, appeared timed to draw the most attention from Washington. Some speculated that Pyongyang wanted some of the spotlight focused on Iran's nuclear program.

"North Korea wants to get the U.S. to direct bilateral negotiations by using the missile card," said Paik Hak-soon, a North Korea expert at the Seoul-based Sejong Institute. "Timing the launch date on July 4 is an attempt to apply maximum pressure on the U.S. government."

North Korea remained undaunted. A North Korea Foreign Ministry official told Japanese journalists in Pyongyang that the regime there has an undeniable right to test missiles.

"The missile launch is an issue that is entirely within our sovereignty. No one has the right to dispute it," Ri Pyong Dok, a researcher on Japanese affairs at the North's Foreign Ministry, said on footage aired by Japanese television network TBS. "On the missile launch, we are not bound by any agreement."

Japanese national broadcaster NHK reported that an unidentified Foreign Ministry official in Pyongyang acknowledged the firing of the missiles, but Mr. Ri told reporters diplomats like himself are unaware of what the military is doing.

In Russia, Interfax quoted the army chief of staff, General Yuri Baluyevsky as saying the number of missiles fired by North Korea could be higher than the six cited by the U.S., Japan and South Korea.

"According to various data, 10 missiles were launched. Some say that these were missiles of various classes; however, some claim that all missiles were intercontinental," Gen. Baluyevsky was quoted as saying at a news conference in the Russian Far East city of Chita.

In Tokyo, Japanese Foreign Minister Taro Aso warned of a "very high possibility" the UN would level economic sanctions against North Korea. Japan also protested the launches officially through the Chinese capital, and banned a North Korean ferry from Japanese ports for six months.

The tests followed weeks of mounting speculation that North Korea would launch a Taepodong-2. U.S. intelligence reports indicated Pyongyang was taking steps to prepare for a launch, but the timing was unknown. North Korea refused to confirm the preparations, but insisted it had the right to such a test.

The test was likely to cast a pall over efforts to lure North Korea back to stalled six-party talks on its nuclear weapons program. Pyongyang has boycotted the negotiations to protest a U.S. crackdown on alleged North Korean counterfeiting and other financial crimes. A North Korean official said Wednesday his country would stand by that stance.

Diplomatic moves over North Korea gathered pace. U.S. nuclear envoy Christopher Hill was to leave Washington for the region later on Wednesday, and the launches coincided with a trip by South Korea's security chief to Washington for consultations. China's vice-premier was also scheduled to go to Pyongyang next week.

Two U.S. State Department officials, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said the long-range missile was the Taepodong-2, North Korea's most advanced missile with a range of up to 15,000 kilometres. Some experts believe it could reach the United States with a light payload.

The missiles all landed hundreds of kilometres away from Japan and there were no reports the missiles caused damage within Japanese territory, said Japanese spokesman Shinzo Abe.

North Korea's missile program is based on Scud technology provided by the former Soviet Union or Egypt, according to American and South Korean officials. North Korea started its Rodong-1 missile project in the late 1980s and test-fired the missile for the first time in 1993.

North Korea had observed a moratorium on long-range missile launches since 1999.

from: [url="http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20060705.w2nkmiss0705/BNStory/International/home"]The Globe and Mail[/url]

Fiona · Post by **Fiona** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:02 am

The tests and the impertinent North Korean attitude sparked fears that further firings could follow.

Now that is a telling sentence

Dowaco · Post by **Dowaco** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:04 am

I really fail to see the logic in countries like N. Korea or Iran testing the US or the UN. Can they not see what happened to the Taliban and to Saddam? Do they think that Bush will play chicken with them? That he will back down? They must have worse intelligence than the US did before Iraq.

Here is as good a place as any to comment because all I see here is Bush bashing and mostly from foreigners. At the time of the initiation of the Iraq war, Bush's approval rating was 97%. He gave a powerful speech after Sept 11, 2001 and at the State of the Union. He outlined the plan for the war on terror and told everyone up front that it would be long and hard. Everyone was onboard with that.

In the last few years Democrats have used American's short term memory and the biased reporting by the press to erode support for the war on terror for their own political gains. It has not helped that Bin Laden is still at large but there have been no terror attacks in the US for 5 years.

Bush has remained steadfast in his determination to continue the global fight against terrorism. Something he vowed to do 5 years ago and political pressure has not swayed him. I admire that. And the Koreans would do well to study some Bush history.

"The battle is now joined on many fronts. We will not waver; we will not tire; we will not falter; and we will not fail." -G. W. Bush 10/7/01 before sending troops to Afganistan.

I cannot fathom what the N. Koreans are thinking. This path can only lead to disaster for the whole world.

Fiona · Post by **Fiona** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:12 am

Is it possible they think they are a sovereign nation?

Luis Antonio · Post by **Luis Antonio** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:13 am

Bush stirred the hive.

I wonder how much support (or hatred) the Korean will achieve. Their mililtary strenght is vastly superior than Iraq's was, but I doubt they'd be able to handle a world intervention (yes, WWIII).

I think it is easier to have a global scale war started by the north Korean than any other nation in the world.