Giant ice shelf snaps free from Canada's Arctic

[dragon wench]

I hope I'm not the only one here who finds this extremely worrying....

[url="http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20061228.wshelf1228/BNStory/National/home"]Giant ice shelf snaps free from Canada's Arctic[/url]

A giant ice shelf the size of 11,000 football fields has snapped free from Canada's Arctic, leaving a trail of icy boulders floating in its wake.

The mass of ice broke clear from the coast of Ellesmere Island, about 800 kilometres south of the North Pole.

Warwick Vincent of Laval University, who studies Arctic conditions, travelled to the newly formed ice island and couldn't believe what he saw.

“It was extraordinary,” Dr. Vincent said Thursday, adding that in 10 years of working in the region he has never seen such a dramatic loss of sea ice.

“This is a piece of Canadian geography that no longer exists.”

The collapse was so powerful that earthquake monitors 250 kilometres away picked up tremors from it.

Scientists say it is the largest event of its kind in 30 years and point their fingers at climate change as a major contributing factor.

“We think this incident is consistent with global climate change,” Dr. Vincent said, adding that the remaining ice shelves are 90 per cent smaller than when they were first discovered in 1906.

“We aren't able to connect all of the dots ... but unusually warm temperatures definitely played a major role.”

The ice shelf actually broke up 16 months ago, but no one witnessed the dramatic event.

Laurie Weir, who monitors ice conditions for the Canadian Ice Service, was poring over satellite images when she noticed that the shelf had split and separated.

Ms. Weir notified Luke Copland, head of the new global ice lab at the University of Ottawa, who initiated an effort to find out what happened.

Using U.S. and Canadian satellite images, as well as data from seismic monitors, Dr. Copland discovered that the ice shelf collapsed in the early afternoon of Aug. 13, 2005.

“These ice shelves can break up really quickly, perhaps more quickly than we thought they could do in the past,” he said.

“Within an hour we could see this entire ice chunk just disconnect and float away.”

Within days, the floating ice shelf had drifted a few kilometres offshore. It travelled west for 50 kilometres until it finally froze into the sea ice in the early winter.

Derek Mueller, a polar researcher with Dr. Vincent's team, saw that Ellesmere's Ward Hunt Ice Shelf had cracked in half in 2002. He also saw that sea ice, which creates a buffer zone around ice shelves, was approaching lower and lower levels.

“These ice shelves get weaker and weaker as the temperature rises,” he said.

“And the summer of 2005 had a combination of high temperatures and strong winds that probably blew the sea ice away, making this ice shelf much more vulnerable.”

The Ayles Ice Shelf, roughly 66 square kilometres in area, was one of six major ice shelves remaining in Canada's Arctic.

They are packed with ancient ice that dates back over 3000 years, and scientists like Dr. Vincent treat their loss as a sign that the global climate is crossing an unprecedented threshold.

“We're seeing the tragic loss of unique features of the Canadian landscape,” he said.

“There are microscopic organisms and entire ecosystems associated with this ice, so we're losing a part of Canada's natural richness.”

Meanwhile, the spring thaw may bring another concern as the warming temperatures could release the ice shelf from its Arctic grip.

Prevailing winds could then send the ice island southwards, deep into the Beaufort Sea.

“Over the next few years this ice island could drift into populated shipping routes,” Ms. Weir said.

“There's significant oil and gas development in this region as well, so we'll have to keep monitoring its location over the next few years.”

[Sean The Owner]

thats pretty crazy, i do like destruction though...i claim that piece of ice MINE!

edit: and no, im not worried, since the more ice that breaks off becomes mine, and because its just a piece of ice...whats the worst it can do? besides take out the titanic...just move more inland and you'll be safe

[dragon wench]

Er Sean...
Ever heard of climate change?

[Aegis]

thats pretty crazy, i do like destruction though...i claim that piece of ice MINE!

edit: and no, im not worried, since the more ice that breaks off becomes mine, and because its just a piece of ice...whats the worst it can do? besides take out the titanic...just move more inland and you'll be safe

Silly boy... Everyone knows you need a flag before you can claim things! It was all written in the "English Guide to Imperialism: Conquering the World One Gin At a Time"

[dragon wench]

Silly boy... Everyone knows you need a flag before you can claim things! It was all written in the "English Guide to Imperialism: Conquering the World One Gin At a Time"

ROFL!
I was about to request a "no spam" tag, but I'm glad I didn't just for that

[Magrus]

Ooh, who wants to bet someone claims it for making snow cones?

Seriously, highly disturbing, but not surprising. I have mentioned for years that the winters were getting warmer and that it was bad. No one here seems to feel the same way, as they have been happy. No snow means no stressful driving for the folks around here. They seem to no be able to concieve the long term problems that a higher climate world wide can cause for everyone.

[DaemonJ]

It is always interesting when someone recalls the winters of their youth being long, cold, and full of snow and then following that up with a statement about how the winters for the last decade have been short and mild. Then ask them about global warming and they say it is rubbish and a scare tactic.

This event is just another among many of which that certainly should cause people to ask questions and possibly take action. Perhaps the beginning of the movie "Day After Tomorrow" may possibly come close to actually happening.

It definitely makes me want to ensure that I have a good inventory of snow gear and winter survival gear.

[Chimaera182]

I worry about the fact that it went in the water. I assumed it slid off some precipice and plunged into the water, all the more so by the fact that earthquake monitors picked up the seismic disturbances. Tidal waves? I suppose no if no one's talking about it, but that's never a good guage for anything.

People are dumb (yes, I say that a lot). Many are more interested in the short-term gratification and less interested in delayed gratification (something I tend to think of as a characteristic of being mature). The notion that things are good now but they might suck in future doesn't appeal to some people.

[Magrus]

This is bugging me. 11,000 football fields? I'm not big on sports, I know they are 100 yards long from end zone to end zone, but how wide? 20 yards? So I'll say 1,100,000 yards long and 220,000 yards wide.

That amounts to 625 miles long and 125 miles wide. Now, if I'm not just overtired and completely screwing this up, the size of the shelf would be roughly as long as it would be if you went from the widest points of Texas west-east. The point where Texas meets the Gulf of Mexico and the bottom west corner of Louisana in the east to the point where the west end of Texas is along the bottom of New Mexico's border and along the Mexican border. This, with the width equal to the length of Massachusetts going from W-E.

This means that the ice shelf is as long as the width of the biggest state in the US, and as wide as the entire width of one of the smallest states from border to border of both. I think I can be pretty safe in saying that it as big, if not bigger than the entirety of the state of New York on a rough estimate. Adding that with the quote of "Dr. Vincent said, adding that the remaining ice shelves are 90 per cent smaller than when they were first discovered in 1906." is quite worrying to me.

[Sean The Owner]

Er Sean...
Ever heard of climate change?

i have, but was drinking too much champagne at the time...:

Silly boy... Everyone knows you need a flag before you can claim things! It was all written in the "English Guide to Imperialism: Conquering the World One Gin At a Time"

i have one...its my avatar...its a flag, that blows in the wind and shows an emoticon face getting hit by a tomato...

Ooh, who wants to bet someone claims it for making snow cones?

too late, its taken by me already, and its my new home, im not going to eat it, although if you want a lemon snow cone it can be arranged...:laugh:

but, onto the serious stuff...i dont even know whats going on anymore, so ill re-read it...

places 250km away felt tremers? well, my town was warned about a slight earthquake(which i slept through while the rest of my family paniced/paniked/panic-ed?(it doesnt look right...) and ya, that could have been why we were supposed to have that earthquake...

i blame this on bush and canadas (is he new?) prime minister, bush, for not signing the global warming agreement, and the prime minister for wanting to de-sign it...i forget what it was called though

[wing]

<snip>

This means that the ice shelf is as long as the width of the biggest state in the US, and as wide as...

<snip>

alaska is the biggest state, not texas. texas is the biggest of the 48 states that are together, if that's what you mean. and if you were talking about alaska, sorry.

to global warming, first of all, cows put out something like 100 times more polution than we do. it's not our fault. and the warming is just a part of the earth's normal cycle. it gets cold, an ice age happens, and then it gets warm. ice age, warm, ice age, warm, etc.

[Xandax]

<snip>
to global warming, first of all, cows put out something like 100 times more polution than we do. it's not our fault. and the warming is just a part of the earth's normal cycle. it gets cold, an ice age happens, and then it gets warm. ice age, warm, ice age, warm, etc.

If anything - we would be heading toward a new iceage if following that cycle
And that is a common .... lets call it misconception.

Firstly - the amount of "cows" are all kept by humans are thus that is also a byproduct of humans. We've domesticated nature by cutting down forrests and placing cattle there instead, to fit into our productionschemes.
Cows are a product of human influence.

Anyways....
Measurements of CO2 in the air exists back many many years due to icedrillings from amongst other Greenland and Antarctica, and if you look at the CO2 over the last thousand years, you'll get a curve which is explosive growth over the last 200 years or so. I've even read somewhere the CO2 level was the highest in about 500.000 years as indicated by these drilling's.

Pretty bit indication that something fishy is going on.

It is not just the warmth cycle of the earth, and most nobody seems to think that anymore.... well nobody that actually looked at this issue.
The "it isn't our fault" smacks so much of washing ones hands of what potentially could be the biggest people-killer in our existence simply because there isn't money in it. This will effect everybody.

And even if it isn't totally "human effected", then if we can do something and save the lives of millions of people and avoid many scary scenarios (results from floods/drought) , wouldn't it be worth helping simply by avoiding to drive that SUV to the baker down the road

[Tricky]

- "Nothing quite brings out the zest for life in a person like the thought of their impending death."

I say global warming needs to happen at a faster rate, or no one will notice and nothing will change. Push the boat over the edge of the waterfall and people will started rowing her back up. Sploosh! Have we as a species actually managed to learn from anything other than our own mistakes? Fable, you seem to be the historian here. Enlighten me.

[VonDondu]

Silly boy... Everyone knows you need a flag before you can claim things! It was all written in the "English Guide to Imperialism: Conquering the World One Gin At a Time"

Are you saying that you put a flag in every glass of gin?

DW: Thanks for not putting a "No Spam" tag on this thread.

[VonDondu]

This is bugging me. 11,000 football fields? I'm not big on sports, I know they are 100 yards long from end zone to end zone, but how wide? 20 yards? So I'll say 1,100,000 yards long and 220,000 yards wide.

That amounts to 625 miles long and 125 miles wide...

Fortunately, your math is wrong. You're not supposed to multiply each side of a football field by 11,000; you're supposed to multiply the area of a football field by 11,000. You're off by a factor of 11,000.

I assume we're supposed to be talking about a Canadian football field. A Canadian football field is 100 meters long and 59.4 meters wide. I assume that includes the sidelines as well as the actual playing area, but I don't care enough about football to look it up. Therefore, one Canadian football field is 5940 square meters. 11,000 Canadian football fields equals 65,340,000 square meters. There are 2,589,988 square meters in every square mile, so the ice shelf by this particular reckoning is about 25.228 square miles, or about 16,150 acres for those who want to compare it to a large Texas ranch.

I read an article yesterday at CNN.com that said the ice shelf that broke off was about 41 square miles, so apparently someone else's math is also wrong, or else they're talking about a different kind of football field. EDIT: Or maybe they meant that the original ice shelf was about 41 square miles and about two-thirds of it broke off and drifted away from the mainland.

[Aegis]

Are you saying that you put a flag in every glass of gin?

DW: Thanks for not putting a "No Spam" tag on this thread.

I am not English. Red Skins do it differently...

As for the Ice Shelf, it is a rather perturbing event. Even just thinking of the water displacement, combined with the fact such a loss in ice shelf integrity occured. It amazes me that there are still those out there who deny the effects of Global Warming. Though, more than Kyoto needs to happen to solve the problem, it is at least a start, but as long as the Western world has such a consumer driven society which emphasizes big cars, big guns, big spending, nothing will ever happen. Simply put, we are slowly killing ourselves...

One can only hope that the next Polar Reversal this planet is due for will kindly fling the impediments to survival from the surface....

[Magrus]

Fortunately, your math is wrong. You're not supposed to multiply each side of a football field by 11,000; you're supposed to multiply the area of a football field by 11,000. You're off by a factor of 11,000.

Heh, I'll remember not to do math, even basic math when not able to sleep for something to do late at night.

@ Wing, You're right. As I said before, I posted that during one of my late night "Whatever can I find to do since I haven't been sleeping for days and no one's awake to amuse me?!" periods. Errors occurred. That one, was a lot closer to the truth than my incredible math error however.

[DaemonJ]

Fortunately, your math is wrong. You're not supposed to multiply each side of a football field by 11,000; you're supposed to multiply the area of a football field by 11,000. You're off by a factor of 11,000.

I assume we're supposed to be talking about a Canadian football field. A Canadian football field is 100 meters long and 59.4 meters wide. I assume that includes the sidelines as well as the actual playing area, but I don't care enough about football to look it up. Therefore, one Canadian football field is 5940 square meters. 11,000 Canadian football fields equals 65,340,000 square meters. There are 2,589,988 square meters in every square mile, so the ice shelf by this particular reckoning is about 25.228 square miles, or about 16,150 acres for those who want to compare it to a large Texas ranch.

I read an article yesterday at CNN.com that said the ice shelf that broke off was about 41 square miles, so apparently someone else's math is also wrong, or else they're talking about a different kind of football field. EDIT: Or maybe they meant that the original ice shelf was about 41 square miles and about two-thirds of it broke off and drifted away from the mainland.

The 2 news articles that I have seen regarding this have both said 25 square miles in size. As such, I have to agree with your math and that the earlier report was incorrect.

[Magrus]

Firstly - the amount of "cows" are all kept by humans are thus that is also a byproduct of humans. We've domesticated nature by cutting down forrests and placing cattle there instead, to fit into our productionschemes.
Cows are a product of human influence.

Exactly what I was planning to say earlier today when I got home. I forgot to put this in earlier. Blaming the cows for the sheer amount of gas they produce is like blaming the cars all of the people drive. If humans had not killed off all of the creatures that used to prey on those cows, enslaved them to live in pens for the sole purpose of producing food for our species and only our species. With an obscene amount of growth in the species to continue feeding our insanely explosive population over the past hundreds of years, that gas wouldn't be a problem. If those trees weren't cut down, the gas produced would have been changed back to oxygen and all would be well too.

[Chimaera182]

Simply put, we are slowly killing ourselves...

The way I've always seen it, we have two options. Either we kill ourselves slowly, or we kill ourselves quickly. The majority of people tend to lean towards the former, but if more people would lean towards the latter, the world might be a better place.