Time off from the Warrens (spoiler?)
Time off from the Warrens (spoiler?)
I don't think it has come up in many discussions, but down in the Warrens, if you get bored, you can exit that very linear mission and pop into the general world via the door in the underground office. It may not add much to the game, but it does get you out of that place and able to re-arm with any ammo that you don't get in the sewers or blood-packs.
I'm not sure if there is any plot-point linked to this fact, but it does show how the head-runners can get into Hollywood.
I'm not sure if there is any plot-point linked to this fact, but it does show how the head-runners can get into Hollywood.
"All the world's a stage and all the men and women merely players"
I think it's what they call in French "un secret de Polichinelle", that's to say a secret that's out in the open. It is fairly obvious (BTW there are two offices, one close to the end of the first level and one close to the start of the third level, both having doors leading to the sewers of Hollywood). And they are indeed handy - certainly if you play a Ventrue and need to tank some extra blood, rats being excluded as a source of blood.
a note to anybody that wants to use them - you must open each of them from the warren-side before you can use them freely - I tried to jump ahead, but there is no way to open the 2nd door form the sewers until it is opened from the other side.
I think a side story got dropped - the investigators in the sewers/the ledgers etc - has the marks of a mission, but no points.
I think a side story got dropped - the investigators in the sewers/the ledgers etc - has the marks of a mission, but no points.
"All the world's a stage and all the men and women merely players"
- Jhereg
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*** Spoilers ***
Also, sometimes the weapons with alternate fire modes will lock up on you. Save the game, quit and re-start, and the alternate modes are restored.
Also, Celacena, I believe you were the one who brought up the alternate camera angles in the mansion tape leading to the warrens? You're right - definitely more than one camera angle, and if the victim is not acting, they all had to be set up in advance. About nine or ten placements, as near as I can tell, and at least one of them is not automatic - it has to be manned by a sentient being. The rest of them could be automatic and controlled by computer.
Good catch - good eyes. Damn, how do you do that?
Probably true, and I found out something on this pass that I didn't know before. The automatic shotgun? You can get that a lot sooner than I thought (this might be old news to some of you) if you visit Mercurio. I got it before the warrens. The spiders and trolls? Jaegerspaz on full auto, and they're dust in about 1.3 seconds. Bloody awesome. I went through the warrens in record time. None of this POW....POW...POW, but more like POWPOWPOWPOW. With that thing, you can waste a spider in about 2 seconds.Celacena wrote:a note to anybody that wants to use them - you must open each of them from the warren-side before you can use them freely - I tried to jump ahead, but there is no way to open the 2nd door form the sewers until it is opened from the other side.
I think a side story got dropped - the investigators in the sewers/the ledgers etc - has the marks of a mission, but no points.
Also, sometimes the weapons with alternate fire modes will lock up on you. Save the game, quit and re-start, and the alternate modes are restored.
Also, Celacena, I believe you were the one who brought up the alternate camera angles in the mansion tape leading to the warrens? You're right - definitely more than one camera angle, and if the victim is not acting, they all had to be set up in advance. About nine or ten placements, as near as I can tell, and at least one of them is not automatic - it has to be manned by a sentient being. The rest of them could be automatic and controlled by computer.
Good catch - good eyes. Damn, how do you do that?
"No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife between the shoulder blades will seriously cramp his style." Steven K.Z. Brust, "Jhereg", ISBN 0-441-38553-2, Chapter 17, prologue.
- Anaximander
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[quote="Jhereg]About nine or ten placements"]
Doesn't Andrei admit to creating the tape when you ask him about it? "Oh yes, the tape. Merely a test....." And then he goes on about how it wasn't meant to fall into mortal hands.
I actually looked around in his mansion my last game to see if I could spot any cameras. I didn't see any, but that's hardly conclusive. He could be using covert cameras or he could have simply taken them down.
Doesn't Andrei admit to creating the tape when you ask him about it? "Oh yes, the tape. Merely a test....." And then he goes on about how it wasn't meant to fall into mortal hands.
I actually looked around in his mansion my last game to see if I could spot any cameras. I didn't see any, but that's hardly conclusive. He could be using covert cameras or he could have simply taken them down.
".... for I had seen the Human face of the Vampires, and now I beheld the monstrousness of these Men..."
Ooops, I thought that was generally known... I think you can get the spazz from Mercurio from the moment Hollywood gets unlocked, but not sure, and certainly before the warrens. And after all, on the beach in Santa Monica, he did tell you to come and visit him if you wanted some goodies (if you ask about weapons).Jhereg wrote:Probably true, and I found out something on this pass that I didn't know before. The automatic shotgun? You can get that a lot sooner than I thought (this might be old news to some of you) if you visit Mercurio. I got it before the warrens. The spiders and trolls? Jaegerspaz on full auto, and they're dust in about 1.3 seconds. Bloody awesome. I went through the warrens in record time. None of this POW....POW...POW, but more like POWPOWPOWPOW. With that thing, you can waste a spider in about 2 seconds.
As for the tape - Andrei admitted as much as to making it I thought.
- Jhereg
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That wasn't the point. Celacena noted that the footage was taken from a number of different angles. There are two possibilities - emplaced cameras, or multiple camera-people. A lot of the footage could be taken from emplaced static cameras, but the final death-scene? That needs a being. Perhaps Andrei, perhaps not. But that camera starts on the door, zooms back, pans right, and then pans back left and zooms in. There was somebody in that house that was not the unfortunate girl or a head-runner.Coruel wrote:As for the tape - Andrei admitted as much as to making it I thought.
As Celacena so cleverly observed, there was more there than meets the eye. The good odds are that there were at least 8 vampires with obfuscate in that house videotaping. Probably more, because there is no way to predict the path that the girl would have followed in her panic. There's a pretty good chance that there were over 20 camera-vampires in that house.
"No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife between the shoulder blades will seriously cramp his style." Steven K.Z. Brust, "Jhereg", ISBN 0-441-38553-2, Chapter 17, prologue.
- Anaximander
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A fully automated surveillance system with cameras mounted strategically around the house could have captured most of the video we see. You're right that the death scene would require concious control. However, pan/tilt/zoom (PTZ) cams can be controlled remotely.
But then, it's unlikely that Andrei would be using that kind of sophisticated surveillance equipment. That's something I might expect from the Nosferatu, but not from an Old World Tzimicse.
So, 10-20 assistants with camcorders hidden from view... Maybe some Lasombra vampires? They're affiliated with the Sabbat and with their Obtenebration discipline they could be hiding literally in the shadows.
But then, it's unlikely that Andrei would be using that kind of sophisticated surveillance equipment. That's something I might expect from the Nosferatu, but not from an Old World Tzimicse.
So, 10-20 assistants with camcorders hidden from view... Maybe some Lasombra vampires? They're affiliated with the Sabbat and with their Obtenebration discipline they could be hiding literally in the shadows.
".... for I had seen the Human face of the Vampires, and now I beheld the monstrousness of these Men..."
it took me ages to articulate the point about camera angles - I knew there was something about the tape that made me uneasy (apart from a scared woman being chased by head-runners) and it was that there appeared to need to be a camera operator amongst the head-runners. also, as somebody said, nobody could be sure exactly where she would run and for the end scene, they would have required certainty that they would capture the "money shot" (two pennies for the ferry-man). that suggests that there were creatures/vamps who were not frightened to be around the head-runners which simply seem programmed to attack on sight without any use of cunning or intelligence. they like being in holes - from the warrens, but the burrowing instinct is common to most creatures, so nothing to imply rational thought there. I don't think that they have FoF radar, so whoever filmed wasn't triggering their attack mode. if the creators have control, they could have been standing there - but there is no reaction from the woman to anything but the runners - she would have implored a vamp for rescue -seeing it as recognisibly human in form - or if Tmisze, recoiled from that too. she did neither - so it would seem that (within the game parameters) it would take obfuscate-enabled vamps to film it.
which brings us on to hallowbrook - lots of sabbat and their ghouls - yet their disciplines do NOT include using obfuscate to ambush - they use protean etc - the up-front attacking disciplines - but not ambush ones.
Heather always wears her original clothing - tight crop-top - even though I have her in her goth outfit most of the game. It is a shame that even with celerity 5 you can't save her - as it is a cut scene - which bugs me a bit.
for the RPG aspect, I'd have preferred that if you save her - LaX or Nines then gets her - so that she is either with Nines when you rediscover him and she's safe as a ghoul or that LaX has her as a hostage at the end - even though a vamp would not sacrifice themselves for their ghoul, LaX might use her as a distraction and him killing her (or not) would make the final confrontation all the more satisfying. if he was holding her hostage - then with high firearms, you might get a head shot, or a blood strike or with celerity run up and stab him - any of those could free her from his clutches and OK she might get injured, but she'd have a chance THEN when you have injured LaX, he is on the floor and the existing cut-scene continues.
I'd like it that she runs to the Last Round after hallowbrook and Damsel looks after her as the ghoul of an ally. I feel a bit guilty being unable to save her, as you can see. I know she was mortally wounded at the hospital and any extra time she gets is thanks to the PC, but I would like to have the option of taking the body-armour (which she runs up for you as she is a clothing-design student?) AND keeping her as my ghoul.
shame the game was rushed out - there was a lot more RP that could have been included.
BTW - do ghouls get unlimited life expectancy whilst still drinking vamp blood?
which brings us on to hallowbrook - lots of sabbat and their ghouls - yet their disciplines do NOT include using obfuscate to ambush - they use protean etc - the up-front attacking disciplines - but not ambush ones.
Heather always wears her original clothing - tight crop-top - even though I have her in her goth outfit most of the game. It is a shame that even with celerity 5 you can't save her - as it is a cut scene - which bugs me a bit.
for the RPG aspect, I'd have preferred that if you save her - LaX or Nines then gets her - so that she is either with Nines when you rediscover him and she's safe as a ghoul or that LaX has her as a hostage at the end - even though a vamp would not sacrifice themselves for their ghoul, LaX might use her as a distraction and him killing her (or not) would make the final confrontation all the more satisfying. if he was holding her hostage - then with high firearms, you might get a head shot, or a blood strike or with celerity run up and stab him - any of those could free her from his clutches and OK she might get injured, but she'd have a chance THEN when you have injured LaX, he is on the floor and the existing cut-scene continues.
I'd like it that she runs to the Last Round after hallowbrook and Damsel looks after her as the ghoul of an ally. I feel a bit guilty being unable to save her, as you can see. I know she was mortally wounded at the hospital and any extra time she gets is thanks to the PC, but I would like to have the option of taking the body-armour (which she runs up for you as she is a clothing-design student?) AND keeping her as my ghoul.
shame the game was rushed out - there was a lot more RP that could have been included.
BTW - do ghouls get unlimited life expectancy whilst still drinking vamp blood?
"All the world's a stage and all the men and women merely players"
- Anaximander
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They certainly live longer than average humans, but they do still age.Celacena]which brings us on to hallowbrook - lots of sabbat and their ghouls - yet their disciplines do NOT include using obfuscate[/quote] No wrote:BTW - do ghouls get unlimited life expectancy whilst still drinking vamp blood?
".... for I had seen the Human face of the Vampires, and now I beheld the monstrousness of these Men..."
they may be good at using shadows - but I'm better! I sneak-kill those guys.
was that discipline going to be available to the PC and then dropped? the other disciplines that you see used are ones available to the PC in one clan or another.
it is like the opposite of Bach who disappears in light.
I find that the AI for Bach isn't very good - if you run straight away and confront him at the top of the steps, he disappears down below and with the PC having the height advantage, it is only a matter of time before you fill him full of lead. he never comes back up to get a better shot, so hiding on the ledge and peeking over to let off a round is just a matter of patience.
was that discipline going to be available to the PC and then dropped? the other disciplines that you see used are ones available to the PC in one clan or another.
it is like the opposite of Bach who disappears in light.
I find that the AI for Bach isn't very good - if you run straight away and confront him at the top of the steps, he disappears down below and with the PC having the height advantage, it is only a matter of time before you fill him full of lead. he never comes back up to get a better shot, so hiding on the ledge and peeking over to let off a round is just a matter of patience.
"All the world's a stage and all the men and women merely players"
- Anaximander
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It's possible, but only the former devs would know for sure. The Lasombra and the Tzimicse are the two controlling clans of the Sabbat. The Lasombra are to the Sabbat what the Ventrue are to the Camarilla. My opinion is that they put these three in there to satisfy PnP players who would be wondering where the Lasombra are in this coven of Sabbat vampires. I usually sneak kill them too, unless I'm playing Tremere. Then a Blood Boil on the guy in the center can take out all three.was that discipline going to be available to the PC and then dropped?
".... for I had seen the Human face of the Vampires, and now I beheld the monstrousness of these Men..."
- Jhereg
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Check Mercurio. If that ghoul ain't a full-on '70s disco-boy, I'm Albert Einstein. Doesn't look a day over 30, either.Celacena wrote:BTW - do ghouls get unlimited life expectancy whilst still drinking vamp blood?
"No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife between the shoulder blades will seriously cramp his style." Steven K.Z. Brust, "Jhereg", ISBN 0-441-38553-2, Chapter 17, prologue.
cheat
not true. i found a little cheat. if you enter noclip and hover in the door frame at the right angle, you get the enter sign. if you haven't entered that door before it just goes straight to the cut scene of you being washed out of a sewer pipe... and presto- you cut some of the monotonous combat out of the warrens.Celacena wrote:a note to anybody that wants to use them - you must open each of them from the warren-side before you can use them freely - I tried to jump ahead, but there is no way to open the 2nd door form the sewers until it is opened from the other side.
I think a side story got dropped - the investigators in the sewers/the ledgers etc - has the marks of a mission, but no points.