shades, efreeti, djinni, invisible stalker, etc...and animate undead, and summon ally 1-10, shadow conjuration, greater shadow conjuration..
I dont understand why there are so many summoning spells...And efreeti and djinni both show up on the same level... Why would I choose both spells in my spellbook and why would I use one over the other..????
Purpose of Different Summoning spells...?
I am currently playing IWD2 (Black Raven Monastary), so I don't know if the spells you speak of will be useful later on, but... all these spells are from the Dungeons and Dragons game, it's a big world, the game makers probably just wanted to give you the same spells that are in the Players Handbook. True, most of these summoning spells are very similar, but may come in handy in different situations that don't take place in the spine of the world. I think the game makers wanted to give you the same choice as in the pen and paper version. Beside that, it is simply fun.
Someone else out there might have more info on where exactly to use a specific spell.
Someone else out there might have more info on where exactly to use a specific spell.
Every day above ground is a good day.(Unless your an Illithid)
Well, there's a few differences.
IIRC, efreeti are immune to fire but vulnerable to cold and djinni have their own set of resistances (cold?), so there are situations where one is clearly superior to the other based on what the summons will be fighting. The same with the elementals. Early access to decent summoning spells like Animate Dead can be extremely valuable (you get lousy 1 HP rats with Summon Nature's Ally I, I believe), so I fully support having different levels of summons to reflect the increasing power of the caster. Also note that a few summoning spells (Animate Dead, Shades, Shadow Conjuration) maintain their usefulness throughout the game because the summons improve as the caster's level improves, giving you much better monsters for a lower level spell.
Shades and the Shadow Conjuration spells are Illusion spells, so they can be used by a specialist mage that does not have access to Conjuration, and specialist that cannot cast Illusions can use the conjurations. Some of the summoning spells are usable by some classes and not others - e.g. druids do not have Summon Monster (which makes sense, as they have no affinity for many of the monsters that can be summoned by that spell) but get Summon Nature's Ally instead, as well as Elemental Legion and Stalker (two of the best summoning spells in the game).
Gate, Cacofiend, and Summon Fiend represent the power and danger of wizardry (the demons may attack you unless you have Protection from Evil on all characters). Some summons (monster, nature's ally, illusions) are so friendly and receptive to the caster's suggestions that you can control them, whereas you cannot direct many of the more powerful monsters (elementals, demons), although you can bring them to this plane, which action they dislike so much that they will attack anything that moves unless it is magically protected.
I think the variety of summons (both in the number of spells and the reactions of the creatures) is one of the best features of IWD2 - a clear improvement on IWD/HoW. I do agree that the summons overlap and in some cases don't seem to be necessary, but there's always a use somewhere. The lower level summons, bad as they are, are exceedingly valuable to anyone doing HoF mode starting with lvl 1 characters, because the summons receive massive HP and attack bonuses comparable to those of HoF enemies. In that particular situation, it wouldn't even be possible to get off the Targos docks without the lvl 1 summons.
IIRC, efreeti are immune to fire but vulnerable to cold and djinni have their own set of resistances (cold?), so there are situations where one is clearly superior to the other based on what the summons will be fighting. The same with the elementals. Early access to decent summoning spells like Animate Dead can be extremely valuable (you get lousy 1 HP rats with Summon Nature's Ally I, I believe), so I fully support having different levels of summons to reflect the increasing power of the caster. Also note that a few summoning spells (Animate Dead, Shades, Shadow Conjuration) maintain their usefulness throughout the game because the summons improve as the caster's level improves, giving you much better monsters for a lower level spell.
Shades and the Shadow Conjuration spells are Illusion spells, so they can be used by a specialist mage that does not have access to Conjuration, and specialist that cannot cast Illusions can use the conjurations. Some of the summoning spells are usable by some classes and not others - e.g. druids do not have Summon Monster (which makes sense, as they have no affinity for many of the monsters that can be summoned by that spell) but get Summon Nature's Ally instead, as well as Elemental Legion and Stalker (two of the best summoning spells in the game).
Gate, Cacofiend, and Summon Fiend represent the power and danger of wizardry (the demons may attack you unless you have Protection from Evil on all characters). Some summons (monster, nature's ally, illusions) are so friendly and receptive to the caster's suggestions that you can control them, whereas you cannot direct many of the more powerful monsters (elementals, demons), although you can bring them to this plane, which action they dislike so much that they will attack anything that moves unless it is magically protected.
I think the variety of summons (both in the number of spells and the reactions of the creatures) is one of the best features of IWD2 - a clear improvement on IWD/HoW. I do agree that the summons overlap and in some cases don't seem to be necessary, but there's always a use somewhere. The lower level summons, bad as they are, are exceedingly valuable to anyone doing HoF mode starting with lvl 1 characters, because the summons receive massive HP and attack bonuses comparable to those of HoF enemies. In that particular situation, it wouldn't even be possible to get off the Targos docks without the lvl 1 summons.
When your back is against the wall... the other guy is in a whole lotta trouble.
You're welcome. 
Gate is quite useful. The spells that summon uncontrollable entities (elementals, demons) are best used for big fights, either in the number or strength of monsters that your party is facing. If demons/elementals don't have anything to fight, they tend to roam. They also will not follow your party if you move.
Gate is quite useful. The spells that summon uncontrollable entities (elementals, demons) are best used for big fights, either in the number or strength of monsters that your party is facing. If demons/elementals don't have anything to fight, they tend to roam. They also will not follow your party if you move.
When your back is against the wall... the other guy is in a whole lotta trouble.
To add to the previous posts:
Some monsters (Mummies, Djinn) are also unique in that they cast spells. Summoned salamanders create a radius of cold/fire damage to all nearby creatures (ally and foe) and are resistant to their element.
Using the inherent strengths of summoned monsters, you can change strategies with area of affect spells, as foes are distracted from attacking you and swarm around the summoned beasties.
What I have discovered about Gate is that the Gelugon will eventually summon more devils. When I got to the Fort in HOF, the enemies were finally so numerous and full of hit points that my Gelugon eventually did just that and cleaned house.
Also keep in mind that summoned creatures can be assisted with buffs and healing along with your PC's. Imagine a Greater Fire Elemental with Haste or constantly casting Heal on a Rhino Beetle.
Some monsters (Mummies, Djinn) are also unique in that they cast spells. Summoned salamanders create a radius of cold/fire damage to all nearby creatures (ally and foe) and are resistant to their element.
Using the inherent strengths of summoned monsters, you can change strategies with area of affect spells, as foes are distracted from attacking you and swarm around the summoned beasties.
What I have discovered about Gate is that the Gelugon will eventually summon more devils. When I got to the Fort in HOF, the enemies were finally so numerous and full of hit points that my Gelugon eventually did just that and cleaned house.
Also keep in mind that summoned creatures can be assisted with buffs and healing along with your PC's. Imagine a Greater Fire Elemental with Haste or constantly casting Heal on a Rhino Beetle.
"Secret spiders collecting waiting the venom
Something more twisted than their smiles" --
excerpt from Zoroastrian Pattern by Eric Tenneson, c. 2005
Something more twisted than their smiles" --
excerpt from Zoroastrian Pattern by Eric Tenneson, c. 2005
It's also great to summon a Gate demon behind enemy lines to let them wreak havoc.Aerich wrote:Gate is quite useful. The spells that summon uncontrollable entities (elementals, demons) are best used for big fights, either in the number or strength of monsters that your party is facing. If demons/elementals don't have anything to fight, they tend to roam. They also will not follow your party if you move.
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Sir_Toejam
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my favorite is summoning a fire elemental (which you can do fairly early on), right in the middle of a group, and as soon as they start to mob it, cast firestorm and flame strike right on top.
elemental completely unharmed, bad guys completely incinerated.
in fact, it was such a useful strategy, that I decided to tweak the higher level area-effect fire spell (meteor storm) so that it did 6d6 impact damage (no save), and 20d6 fire damage (reflex), just to make things more interesting (makes it kind of like a high level ice storm spell, with fire instead of cold). fire elemental and demons no longer immune. nor is the rest of your party, for that matter - no more immunity through evasion, for example.
and yes, summon undead continues to get better as you gain levels, and always has one "bludgeon resistant" slow zombie type, and one faster bony-type that's resistant to piercing/slashing (50% chance of either, so if you don't get what you want, just try again). tops out with festering drowned dead in zombie type, and apocalyptic boneguard for bony type. both are exceedingly tough, though you kinda have to watch the festering dead, as the aura around them can affect your own party.
I also found that "nature's ally IX" pretty much does the same thing as elemental swarm, just with random types and numbers of high level elementals.
summon monster IX pulls in a wide variety of things, from remorhaz queens to elementals to demons (hard to tell just what you're gonna get).
elemental completely unharmed, bad guys completely incinerated.
in fact, it was such a useful strategy, that I decided to tweak the higher level area-effect fire spell (meteor storm) so that it did 6d6 impact damage (no save), and 20d6 fire damage (reflex), just to make things more interesting (makes it kind of like a high level ice storm spell, with fire instead of cold). fire elemental and demons no longer immune. nor is the rest of your party, for that matter - no more immunity through evasion, for example.
and yes, summon undead continues to get better as you gain levels, and always has one "bludgeon resistant" slow zombie type, and one faster bony-type that's resistant to piercing/slashing (50% chance of either, so if you don't get what you want, just try again). tops out with festering drowned dead in zombie type, and apocalyptic boneguard for bony type. both are exceedingly tough, though you kinda have to watch the festering dead, as the aura around them can affect your own party.
I also found that "nature's ally IX" pretty much does the same thing as elemental swarm, just with random types and numbers of high level elementals.
summon monster IX pulls in a wide variety of things, from remorhaz queens to elementals to demons (hard to tell just what you're gonna get).