BG or BG2 to Start

[Lightning Rod]

Sorry if this has been asked. I searched, but couldn't find an answer.

I want to buy and play BG and/or BG2. Any recommendation as to where to start? Should I go through BG or go straight to BG2? Should I get a combo pack?

I have played NWN, KOTR I & II, and Morrowind so I have very little experience with RPGs. Just enough to be addicted when I'm not fishing.:laugh:

The posts seem to suggest BG2 is probally the better game overall, but will I be missing alot by skipping BG1? Also are there any Must Have Mods to start with? (Maybe a second topic, haven't looked into it)

Thanks

[BlueSky]

My experience was BG II then running out and buying a copy of BG...
If possible I suggest doing them in order BG, then BG II, the sense of history in the storyline would be better that way...
As for mods, check the sticky at the top of the respective forums...
everybody has their own favs....either quest mods or npc's....
links are in the forums...

Happy Gaming.....
beware you'll become addicted to these games....

[VonDondu]

I want to buy and play BG and/or BG2... Should I get a combo pack?

Any version will work as long as you install the latest official patch for each game (if required).

will I be missing alot by skipping BG1?

Definitely yes. You should play BG1 before you play BG2.

First of all, you'll enjoy the main storyline and the quests a lot more if you play BG1 first. Would you skip the first third of a novel and start in the middle of the book?

Second of all, if you have very little experience with RPGs (specifically D&D), then you need to start with a 1st level character instead of a 7th or 8th level character and work your way up through progressively more difficult challenges so you can learn how to play the game. BG1 is difficult for a first-time player, but BG2 demands even more advanced skills from the player.

Also are there any Must Have Mods to start with?

Only the latest patch is "required"; the rest is entirely personal preference. There are a couple of "Fix Packs" which fix problems that were never fixed by Bioware, and there are "Tweak Packs" which alter the game slightly to make it more "user-friendly" or to make it more suitable for the player's taste. The first time you play, I suggest installing an "Ease-of-use" mod to add features like increased ammo stacks. Unfortunately, I don't have a link at the moment.

There are quest mods that add new quests to the game, and they vary wildly in quality. NPC mods add new characters to the game who can join your adventuring party, or add more dialogues and/or quests for the existing NPCs. Banter packs add more dialogue to the game. BG1 comes up short in the NPC dialogue department, but when BG1 was all we had (before BG2 was released), most players were very happy with BG1. Then BG2 came along and spoiled us.

Personally, I think you should play the game in its original form before you install any mods. Play it the way it was originally intended. It's brilliant. After you play the game at least once, then you could try some mods if you think you need more content.

You should also play BG1 several times before playing BG2, for several reasons. First of all, you might miss something the first time you play. Second of all, you will probably want to try the game a second or third time with a different party and/or a different main character. Roleplaying is fun. Furthermore, the more familiar you become with the story, the more you will like it. If you rush through the game only once (or use a walkthrough instead of figuring things out on your own), you might miss important details. For example, how many players realized that the villain has more than one girlfirend? How many players actually understood what the villain was trying to accomplish? You can treat it as a hack-and-slash adventure if you're only interested in killing one monster after the next, but the story is very subtle and very interesting, and if you don't pay attention to the clues the games gives you, you won't "get it". BG1 is like a mystery novel, and that is one of its best features. If you disregard the story because you're more concerned with items and experience points, or if you spoil the mystery by "reading ahead" so to speak (by playing BG2, for example), then you will ruin your own game, in my opinion.

[kmonster]

Your "little" experience with rpgs shouldn't be a problem, BG1 and especially BG2 are rather mainstream products for the masses than for expert games, so even newbies who didn't even care reading the manual finished them, especially since there are so many walkthroughs and forums available where you can get help.

BG2 is a sequel to BG1. You start with a character who as as many experience as if he finished the first game and during the first part of the game you meet characters who remember you what "you" have done during the first game.
If you consider this irritating or if you want to play both games anyway you should rather start with BG1.

I disagree with VonDondu's recommendation about playing through BG1 several times before starting BG2.
The game should be cheap, so the most valuable thing it will take away is your time. It's not your duty to work the game just to make sure you did everything possible. It's not bad at all if you miss something. Spoiled replays are just entertainment you can still have after finishing BG2.

You've only one unspoiled first run, so make it as enjoyable as possible. Don't turn yourself into a walkthrough replaying robot or a save and reload machine to test which dialogue option grants a little more benefit. Don't try to get everything, that's not necessary. It's a roleplaying game, not work you have to do. Dare to play the game, don't work it.

There's no need for mods except the official patches, the games were released and most players played them this way.
I'd only consider the "max HP at level up" and "successful scroll scribing" components from the Ease-of-Use mod for BG1 which will save you some reloading time. The "happy party" component should also be useful.

[Gral]

BG I was my first RPG (then you can you imagine my thrill with this game) and I had no problems with this game. BG 2 have never played (but I am goning to start this summer)

[VonDondu]

I disagree with VonDondu's recommendation about playing through BG1 several times before starting BG2.
The game should be cheap, so the most valuable thing it will take away is your time. It's not your duty to work the game just to make sure you did everything possible. It's not bad at all if you miss something. Spoiled replays are just entertainment you can still have after finishing BG2.

You've only one unspoiled first run, so make it as enjoyable as possible. Don't turn yourself into a walkthrough replaying robot or a save and reload machine to test which dialogue option grants a little more benefit. Don't try to get everything, that's not necessary. It's a roleplaying game, not work you have to do. Dare to play the game, don't work it.

I don't mind if you disagree with my opinion and my preferences, but I think you misunderstood the reasoning behind my suggestion. I did not say it's your "duty" to "work the game" and look under every rock and make sure you don't miss anything the first time you play the game. If you did that, then you wouldn't need to replay the game, and my suggestion wouldn't make any sense. I mean, duh. If you play the game the way that you suggested--roleplaying, immersing yourself in the story, enjoying it as much as possible, not concerning yourself with game mechanics and the infinite number of options available, and not reloading like crazy--then you're bound to miss a lot of things the first time around. That's definitely what happened to me the first time I played BG1 and BG2. So it seemed like a very good idea to me to replay both games, partly to see if I came across anything I missed the first time around, but also to try a different roleplaying idea--a new character, a new theme for my party, a new direction, new goals, etc. Lo and behold, it was a lot of fun to replay the game.

I sense that in your mind, new players should play BG2 as soon as they can, presumably because it's a better game. Maybe that's the right thing to do for a lot of players. But I really got a kick out of playing BG1 several times before BG2 was available, and it would be a shame for a new player to let BG1 fall by the wayside just because it is overshadowed by its successor. After playing BG2, BG1 does indeed suffer a little in comparison. I think that's the best reason not to play BG2 until you've had the pleasure of playing BG1 several times. If you pretend that BG2 doesn't exist, then you can get as much enjoyment out of BG1 as I did before BG2 was available. To put it another way, if you don't know what you're missing, then BG1 is a lot more fun. At least, that's one way to look at it.

Personally, I think that BG1 is superior to BG2 in some ways, mostly in terms of atmosphere and game balance. There is also a big difference in, for lack of a better word, "style". For example, the dialogue in BG2 was obviously written by a different group of people who have a more modern sensibility and vernacular than the people who wrote the dialogue for BG1. (At least, that's how the dialogue comes across to me.) BG1 strikes me as a more traditional D&D game than BG2 (although it has its share of cynicism and wryness, as well). I'm not saying that BG2 is inferior to BG1, but since BG1 has a less modern feel to it, it's easy to slip away into another world. At least, that's my own reaction to it. In some ways, BG2 forces me to think a lot more, but I feel like I'm thinking more like myself than as a fantasy character. BG1 simply has a "feel" to it that isn't present in BG2, and sometimes I miss that.

Anyway, you can certainly play BG1 once, then play BG2 (since the story in BG1 is already "spoiled"), and then you can either replay BG1 or BG2, or play a new game entirely, since BG2 is also "spoiled". It just depends on the individual player.

[kmonster]

You sensed my mind pretty wrong.

I even consider BG1 a better game than BG2. It might have more, more, more of everything, but as a whole it is lacking.
I just see no point in playing BG1 several times before continuing in BG2.
It's as if you read the first half of a book 3 times in a row before you continue the second half since you might have overlooked some details.
If you have both parts of a book you'd rather read the second before rereading the first one.
I don't think highly about replaying rpgs like BG. One run can be special if the story is good, if three characters get through the same main story one after another it's mass hero production for entertainment.
Replaying because of having "missed something" feels to me like squeezing out an already juiced fruit for hours for to get last remaining drops you don't need at all. If you're bored you can do so, but surely not if there's another game you want to play.

[VonDondu]

kmonster-- Okay, that explains why you think people should play BG2 immediately after playing BG1. If I understand you correctly, you think there's no point in replaying any roleplaying game unless you are bored or have some time to kill. I have difficulty wrapping my mind around that idea, so it's no wonder I didn't understand you the first time.

Aside from the fact that I do enjoy playing games over and over, or reading the same books over and over, or listening to the same songs over and over, etc., etc., I think the analogy between a roleplaying game and a novel only goes so far. You can compare one element of a roleplaying game--i.e., the story--to a novel, and I suppose once you know how the story goes, there might not be any point in re-reading the story, so to speak. But playing an RPG is so much different from reading a novel, I don't know where to begin to explain the differences between them. Interaction is one of the most important things. Playing a "living" character in the game is another one. "Acting out a play" (which is what many of my games tend to be like) as opposed to "reading a play" is another one.

And then there's the issue of skill development. Speaking only for myself, my playing skills are pretty lousy the first time I play a game. The more I play, the more my skills improve. Playing different characters allows me to change my tactics. The first time I play a game, my results tend to be awkward and less than smooth, so replaying the game gives me a chance to "do it better" or at least to do it with more style or more finesse. So in a sense, playing a game for the tenth time is a much different experience for me than it was the first time I played it. Whether the story was "spoiled" the first time I played it is completely irrelevant as far as that particular issue is concerned.

The point is, there are many reasons for playing an RPG besides watching the story unfold, and that's why those games have replay value for me.

if three characters get through the same main story one after another it's mass hero production for entertainment...

Yes, a very good sort of entertainment.

Anyway, I think this subject is very personal and very subjective, and I don't mean to argue with you; I just want to present my own point of view. Lightning Rod might be the same kind of gamer you are, so maybe he or she will agree with your suggestions instead of mine. In any case, I hope he or she has a lot of fun.

[wise grimwald]

I agree with VonDondu on this one. I would certainly start with BG1 and play it a number of times with different characters. The game is so different that Icertainly did not get bored playing it dozens of times before moving on to BG2. I am still very much a newbie in BG2. I haven't played Throne of Bhaal yet!
Playing it this way I have had literally years of fun! However the choice is yours.

[sparky_kat]

i definitely suggest playing BG1 first all the way thru at least once (or twice to make sure you have a character you like) before you start BG2. take it from me..... i only played about half of BG1 before i started BG2 (and finished it (BG2))

there were some spots in the dialog that didn't make much sense to me and sometimes confuzzled me, lol, as some dialog refers back to BG1. so it really does help and make sense to play BG1 all the way thru at least once, as i personally feel, to enjoy the game experience that is baldur's gate as a whole.

[Lightning Rod]

Thanks for all the input. It took so long to reply because over the weekend I was busy teaching my Grandaughter to fish. She loved it and it was one of the best times in my life.

It sounds like I should do BG1 first. To me the story and character development are at least as important as 'beating' the game. I'm not much of a power player, but I have got caught up in creating an overpowering character only to realize that path didn't make the game as enjoyable for me IMHO.

Since i'm planning on playing both anyway, I think I'll go the I then II route. I guess I was concerned the graphic limits and play style would be too much a let down after the games I've played. Sounds like I don't need to worry about it.

As for the Mods, I was just thinking a few simple mods to make the basic game more playable. In Morrowind, the only mod I've used was one to make Creeper, a merchant, have alot of gold to deal with and to buy just about everything I've found. It just made the game much easier to deal with all that stuff!!!!

[VonDondu]

Thanks for all the input. It took so long to reply because over the weekend I was busy teaching my Grandaughter to fish. She loved it and it was one of the best times in my life.

That's great. Now she will eat for a lifetime.

Since i'm planning on playing both anyway, I think I'll go the I then II route. I guess I was concerned the graphic limits and play style would be too much a let down after the games I've played. Sounds like I don't need to worry about it.

I don't think the graphics in BG1 are all that bad, despite the lower resolution. Look at it this way: the background artwork was designed to look good at a certain resolution, and it looks pretty good at that resolution.

I can't remember if there's a way to adjust the refresh rate on your screen, but perhaps someone else can help you with that.

Some people might suggest that you install BGTutu, which lets you play BG1 with the BG2 engine. I tried it a long time ago and didn't like it (too difficult to install, too many bugs, you lose the BG1-style menus and music, the BG2 rules are not appropriate for BG1, etc.), but it seems to have been improved a lot in the last couple of years. So the next time I play BG1, I will give it a try. You can now restore the BG1 music and menus with the appropriate mods. If you have basic computer skills and a little bit of patience, EasyTutu is pretty easy to use.

As for the Mods, I was just thinking a few simple mods to make the basic game more playable. In Morrowind, the only mod I've used was one to make Creeper, a merchant, have alot of gold to deal with and to buy just about everything I've found. It just made the game much easier to deal with all that stuff!!!!

Generally speaking, I don't like mods that add new items to the game (other people's sense of balance always seems questionable to me), but I like mods that make inventory management less difficult (for example, larger stacks of ammo and potions), such as the Ease-of-use mod.

If you decide to install BGTutu (I can't make a recommendation one way or the other until I play it myself), you might consider installing a mod called the BG1 NPC Project. It doesn't work with the original release of BG1, but it works with BG Trilogy and BGTutu. I never got tired of listening to the NPCs say their lines over and over again, but after playing BG2 (which has a lot more dialogue than BG1), BG1 leaves a little to be desired in the dialogue department.

Like I said earlier, if you play BG1 before you play BG2, then you won't know what you're missing, and BG1 will seem just fine the way it is.

[fable]

Some people might suggest that you install BGTutu, which lets you play BG1 with the BG2 engine. I tried it a long time ago and didn't like it (too difficult to install, too many bugs, you lose the BG1-style menus and music, the BG2 rules are not appropriate for BG1, etc.), but it seems to have been improved a lot in the last couple of years.

I played it back when it was just Tutu as well, and then later, when development had moved on to EasyTutu. No bugs any longer, very short, easy install, and they've even got a means to put back the old BG1 style menus, if that's what you want.

It sounds like I should do BG1 first. To me the story and character development are at least as important as 'beating' the game. I'm not much of a power player, but I have got caught up in creating an overpowering character only to realize that path didn't make the game as enjoyable for me IMHO.

For what it's worth, I suggest playing BG1 once, with a few mods in place:

EasyTutu: Higher resolution, beyond 800 x 600. Popup labels for buildings in towns. (This alone makes it worth the effort, in my opinion.) Dual wielding. TAB to highlight items on the ground, like loot that you may have missed. New races. New profession kits. This is a good meta page to start from.

The BG1 NPC Project adds many banters, several romances, and a few possible quests to BG1. The banters really help, because this is one area in which everybody agrees BG2 easily surpasses the older game.

BG1 Unfinished Business restores dialogs, encounters, and items that were cut from the final BG1 release, usually because of time restraints. As with so many mods, you can selectively choose which ones to add in the package, and which to leave out. Each is described on the mod's homepage. Up to you, but it seems that UB makes the game more satisfying by providing answers to why things happened a particular way.

[{USI}_Zombie]

I am replaying the game after a many year layoff, and I was unaware of the easytutu until I was well in to bg2 and tob. I finished tob and THEN decided to load up easytutu and replay bg1, (I finished it while on deployment back in '00). I must say that I am enjoying myself, but it IS difficult going from a level 20+ powerhouse of destruction afraid of nothing, to a level 1 weakling full of optimism but not hit points! When I see gnolls or kobolds my 1st thought is "this is gonna be a slaughter" then after actually engaging with my level 1 optimist it changes to "hey, I'm being slaughtered!".
I believe that playing from bg1 BEFORE playing bg2 is a good idea because it will lead to better immersion and roleplaying, as well as the satisfaction of seeing your pc and npc's grow.
I really must recage my brain and start thinking like a low level character.
spoilers:
I

Spoiler

intend to play with what I believe is the "intended" party:
me, Minsc, Jaheira, Imoen, Khalid and Dynaheir...when I played last time, I dumped Jaheira and used Branwin(sp?).
I finished tob with my 1/2 elf fighter, Imoen, Jaheira (romanced), Minsc, Keldorn and Nalia. When I get to bg2 again I think I will take Aerie for the whole time even though I will miss Nalia,(would have rather romanced her than J actually). I don't like Annomen, so I will do his side quests then dump him because this playthrough I am a single class cleric of Lathander(thanks easytutu).