Detect Illusions

Carnifex · Post by **Carnifex** » Sat Apr 11, 2009 11:30 am

Hi,

I'm playing through BG2 with a kensai/thief (dualed at 9 cause I'm running a full group and didn't have the patience to wait any longer) and I've boosted open locks, find traps, set traps, hide and move silently to ~100 respectively.

I know it's worthwhile to increase hide, move silently and pickpocket above 100 - but I'm debating whether or not i should leave hide/ms around 100 for a while and boost PP and Detect Illusions.

Now, is there any point to increasing Detect Illusions past 100 ?

//C

galraen · Post by **galraen** » Sat Apr 11, 2009 12:43 pm

Personally I've never boosted Illusion at all, not since I found out how useless it is.

Carnifex · Post by **Carnifex** » Sat Apr 11, 2009 1:48 pm

galraen wrote:Personally I've never boosted Illusion at all, not since I found out how useless it is.

Ah, then I'll keep my hands off it. Feel free to elaborate what exactly makes it useless, as I have yet to even try it

Also, there's no reason to increase set traps, find traps or open locks past 100, is there ?

//C

Silvanerian · Post by **Silvanerian** » Sat Apr 11, 2009 2:03 pm

Thief skills

Detect illusions functions like a free, near constant true sight when you have the skill at 100.

See that skill (same as set trap) as a percentage marker. At 100, you'll never fail - and going above will not yield any benefits.

Detect illusions works as true sight when you activate the "detect traps" icon. Once a round you'll be detecting traps and illusions. It will dispel mirror image, blur, mislead, invisibility, improved invisibility, shadow door etc. - just like true sight.
Personally, I think it is a very powerful ability considering how quickly you can have it and that it is available at all times.

If true sight is either not available to your group or costly - e.g. 6th level wizard slots, I think detect illusions is a good investment.

I don't really see the point of picking pockets - don't you have tons of gold by now? What is it you would like to steal? And if there is something specific, I'd rather use multiple potions of master thievery.

As for find/disarm traps and open locks, there are very few in the game which require above 100 in skill.
Move silently and hide in shadows will both benefit from higher than 100 points, though with 100 in each you should succeed nearly always already.

Carnifex · Post by **Carnifex** » Sat Apr 11, 2009 2:27 pm

Silvanerian wrote:Detect illusions functions like a free, near constant true sight when you have the skill at 100.

See that skill (same as set trap) as a percentage marker. At 100, you'll never fail - and going above will not yield any benefits.

Detect illusions works as true sight when you activate the "detect traps" icon. Once a round you'll be detecting traps and illusions. It will dispel mirror image, blur, mislead, invisibility, improved invisibility, shadow door etc. - just like true sight.
Personally, I think it is a very powerful ability considering how quickly you can have it and that it is available at all times.

If true sight is either not available to your group or costly - e.g. 6th level wizard slots, I think detect illusions is a good investment.

I don't really see the point of picking pockets - don't you have tons of gold by now? What is it you would like to steal? And if there is something specific, I'd rather use multiple potions of master thievery.

As for find/disarm traps and open locks, there are very few in the game which require above 100 in skill.
Move silently and hide in shadows will both benefit from higher than 100 points, though with 100 in each you should succeed nearly always already.

Thanks for the detailed input, I have some numbers now, thanks to you!

I was aware of Detect Illusions functionality, right now I have an oracle memorized on Haer'Dalis and a True Sight on Viconia to handle the annoying illusions. The thing that bothers me a bit about the thief skill is that it pops once a round when my thief could be backstabing or otherwise inflicting serious damage.

Still curious as to why Galraen thinks it sucks that badly though

Edit: Regarding pickpocket - yes I do have tons of gold but there are some rather interesting items to be pickpocketed in the game, the ability to shoplift isn't the main reason I want it. I pickpocketed an artifact item today, for instance. Granted I could've killed the person carrying it, but still.

//C

Crenshinibon · Post by **Crenshinibon** » Sun Apr 12, 2009 1:41 pm

I always allocate 100 points into Detect Illusions. It is an amazing ability which makes True Sight worthless. Why? For two main reasons: True Sight takes up spots better used for something else AND it dispels the illusions cast by your party! I don't know about you, but most of the time, my mages and even some fighters or thieves have some sort of illusionary spell cast on them, so True Sight is very inconvenient for me. Detect Illusions removes just those on your enemies, without the disadvantage. That, and you can use it at any time you want.

Pick pockets is a great ability to use early on, to shoplift, so you can quickly raise your gold and recharge your wands. Once you hit ToB, you'll probably use it to stock up on potions and purchase new spell scrolls for your mages, but that's about it. I think the skill is much more useful in the original Baldur's Gate.

I think that Hide in Shadows and Move Silently should be your two "priority skills". I usually put about 180 or so in each. Those two skills are simply invaluable for a thief.

galraen · Post by **galraen** » Sun Apr 12, 2009 2:59 pm

Weird, I tried pushing DI up way over 100 and no effect whatsoever. I'm not just talking about the Windspear Hills bug either.

Crenshinibon · Post by **Crenshinibon** » Sun Apr 12, 2009 4:05 pm

It does take a round or so to work. I haven't had any problems with it and think it's great on those Mirror Image and Mislead combinations.

I also forgot to mention that Spell Immunity: Divination nullifies True Sight, while Detect Illusions still goes through that.

Silvanerian · Post by **Silvanerian** » Thu Apr 16, 2009 9:06 am

Cheese (?)

Note on detect illusions:

If you instruct your character to attack and afterwards hit the detect traps (illusions) button, then your character will do both actions at the same time.

Sort of like walking and detecting traps at the same time.

I suppose it can be considered cheesy or an exploit, but on the other hand, it isn't stated anywhere that it takes full concentration to detect illusions/traps.

As for your problems with detect illusions, Galraen - all I can say is "wierd". Have you tried the skill in another game? It has never malfunctioned for me. A good testing ground is the circus tent - the werewolves will get displelled with detect illusions, yet don't cause damage if you fail.

Cookiemole · Post by **Cookiemole** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 4:39 am

cren--what mods are you running? true sight has always been party-friendly for me. thanks for the heads up about spell immunity:divination and detect illusion, i wasn't sure if it bypassed it or not.

silv--never knew that! i wonder if it works for clerics and turning undead.

i'm not positive about this, but i think it might decrease the amount of time it takes to kick in if you raise it above 100. but i could be totally wrong. another thing i think is true, but i'm not positive about, is that your chances of success aren't 100% when you have the skill at 100, and in fact if you raise it over that you will improve you chances of dispelling an illusion. after all, your chances of picking a pocket improve when that skill is increased over 100.

some comments that are only relevant if you have TOB installed: one thing i found detect illusions good for was when my thief needed to dispel illusions within a time stop (usually from a time trap). you don't have access to your mages, clerics, or keldorn inside a time stop! i made a kensai/thief once, and after a time trap went off, it would only take a few seconds for him to sniff out invisible mages and subsequently make chop suey out of them. Also, Ilesara in Ascension TOB has a Bhaalspawn power that allows her to go invisible that is susceptible to detect illusions but not true sight. Being that you have to fight her twice, once at the very beginning and once at the very end, and that she's a huge pain in the ass if you don't kill her immediately, i found this ability to be enormously helpful.

galraen · Post by **galraen** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 5:57 am

Silvanerian wrote:As for your problems with detect illusions, Galraen - all I can say is "wierd". Have you tried the skill in another game?

Probably not with my PC on reflection, but with Jan definitely, but that is with relying on his gadgets. Could it be they don't function as advertised regarding detect illusion?

Edar Macilrille · Post by **Edar Macilrille** » Sun May 02, 2010 12:08 pm

*Palle casts a Necromantic Spell*

Speaking of which, as part of the Saerileth Romance I would like to dispell the illusions in Windspear Hills on those Ogres (thus keeping my old friend Ajantis alive and not upsetting my poor, fragile, devoted, innocent and somewhat fanatic love). No spell seem to work; does the Thief detect Illusion ability? And how to activate it? Look for traps?

vonhizzle · Post by **vonhizzle** » Sun May 02, 2010 1:00 pm

Yes, to activate it detect traps. I don't know if it works in that situation though. Personally I would try some priest spells, detect evil or something. I am not sure if it is possible to not kill those knights though.

Stworca · Post by **Stworca** » Sun May 02, 2010 1:30 pm

It is not possible to NOT kill the knights, or at least i wasn't able to with all the CC spells, magic dispelling, running away and comming back. All in all it is an illusion / suggestion / domination cast by a dragon, and therefore quite powerfull... RP wise

Edar Macilrille · Post by **Edar Macilrille** » Sun May 02, 2010 2:27 pm

IIt should not be possible, usually. But I am pretty certain one of the options during one of my mod installations was "Dispell Illusions on Ogres in Windspear Hills".

I have killed them anyway. Getting bored with trying all the vaious options without success, but it would be nice to avaoid it another time.