The best sneak-magic-cross class?

[Lexeaus]

Not really a question, more a statement. But nonetheless;

I have been playing my character for some 14 hours, and have gotten to level 22. I'm pretty happy with my character, but maybe someone can propose a more refined version of what I have;

Race: Khajiit
Birthsign: The Thief
Class: (Custom) Doombringer
Level: 22

Health: 133
Magicka: 168
Fatigue: 258

(I'm only going to put down my preferred stats here )

Intelligence: 84 (its been damaged, and I have 140 infamy so no forgiveness for me....)
Willpower: 83 (same story as Intellligence)
Agility: 100
Speed: 91

Major Skills;
Alteration: 79
Destruction: 31
Illusion: 40
Mysticism: 46
Light Armour: 100
Marksman: 54 (59 with my permanent +5 boost)
Sneak: 62 (67 with my +5 boost)


I don't use my magic an awful lot (except for my alteration which I use for levelling), I'd rather shoot with my Hatred's Soul bow anyway.

So again, if anyone has a better version of this build, I'd like to hear it.

[fable]

I tend to minimax, so the skills I'd use most I'd take out of Major Skills category. That way, I could close off access to leveling multipliers when I cared to, not when the game did. Your choice, though. That's just the way I handle it.

[Lexeaus]

Yeah, but that way, you have to level up skills that you don't want to, to level. And I really want to enjoy levelling....

[Stworca]

Yeah, but that way, you have to level up skills that you don't want to, to level. And I really want to enjoy levelling....

That way you don't have to level, while gaining power ('tis means i used to do the same as Fable)

[Lexeaus]

I see the reason in that, but doing things like that means you do not get levelled equipment as quickly. But yes, that makes sense.

[galraen]

I see the reason in that, but doing things like that means you do not get levelled equipment as quickly. But yes, that makes sense.

Having a preference for sneaky mages myself, the last thing I worry about is leveled equipment, I use bows I've enchanted myself, and magic. Sneak is nevr a major skill as I use it all the time and all I achieve by leveling up too quickly is to help my enemies. The only changes I'd make to your choice of Major Skills would be to dump Light Armour, why nerf your magic ability, and Sneak I'd replace them with conjuration and mysticism or acrobatics, but I do use mods that use mysticism and acrobatics.

[fable]

I see the reason in that, but doing things like that means you do not get levelled equipment as quickly. But yes, that makes sense.

Plus, if you run various mods, you can actually end up with levelled equipment because you do sometimes encounter things tougher than you, including bosses. For example, in the game I just started, I'm running a sort of battlemage. I've got Martigen's Monster Mod, among a bunch of others, and it's just thrown me at two locations a lesser hill giant, and three vampires (the latter in the sewers under the IC). None of the vampires had any good stash, but one of them was wearing boosts with a light strength enchantment. That's at level 1. It's a fair reward for taking a fair chance.

[Fljotsdale]

Weeellll...... Khajiit are ok as sneakXmagic class, but really their magic ability isn't up to much, imo. Ok, you have a pretty decent character, and it's one I wouldn't sniff at myself but I do like my sneaks to have quite a high level of magica (which is why I currently favour High Elves as a sneakXmagic class, and have The Thief sign with mostly thief and only one or two magic skills in Major. If I use Wood Elf, which is the best sneak, I have to give 'em The Mage sign to boost their magica a bit).

But, to respond to your request, since you don't use magic very much, wasn't it a bit of a waste to have 4 magic skills in Major? (especially Illusion! Ok, it's great for a sneaky type, but sneaks use it a lot - or my sneaks do, anyway - so it bumps up your level far too fast, leaving you vulnerable).
And, as galraen said, having Light armour - or any armour - as a Major skill is a bit of a waste, when with even minimal magic skills, you can enchant clothing to give you more protection than the best armour, even with maximised skill.

[Lexeaus]

Plus, if you run various mods, you can actually end up with levelled equipment because you do sometimes encounter things tougher than you, including bosses. For example, in the game I just started, I'm running a sort of battlemage. I've got Martigen's Monster Mod, among a bunch of others, and it's just thrown me at two locations a lesser hill giant, and three vampires (the latter in the sewers under the IC). None of the vampires had any good stash, but one of them was wearing boosts with a light strength enchantment. That's at level 1. It's a fair reward for taking a fair chance.

Well, I have an XBox version, maybe I forgot to mention that.... And personally I think most mods take the fun out of the game, either making it too technical or too easy. Just my opinion. But thanks anyway.

[galraen]

Well, I have an XBox version, maybe I forgot to mention that.... And personally I think most mods take the fun out of the game, either making it too technical or too easy. Just my opinion. But thanks anyway.

You mean it's not too easy without the mods, wow, I find it the other way around.

[Fljotsdale]

Intelligence: 84 (its been damaged, and I have 140 infamy so no forgiveness for me....)
Willpower: 83 (same story as Intellligence)

Just noticed this. You do know you can fix damaged attributes with spells and/or potions, yes? You don't have to depend on Temple or shrine healing.

[Lexeaus]

Yes, I knew that, but I do find collecting ingredients a pain, especially to restore my -2 points in stats.... But I will look for some

[Lexeaus]

Ok so, after revising my build, I have come up with yet another one;

Race: Breton or High Elf

Sign: Mage, Apprentice or Atronach

Specialisation: Sneak or Magic

Skills:

Illusion
Mysticism
Marksman
Alteration
Alchemy
Conjuration
Destruction

It's pretty heavily based on the magic side, and I am going to level up Sneak before the sewers so I am not lacking, and I added more Intelligence skills, because I want a lot of magicka :3

"Now, to test my theory!"

[Fljotsdale]

Ok so, after revising my build, I have come up with yet another one;

Race: Breton or High Elf

Sign: Mage, Apprentice or Atronach

Specialisation: Sneak or Magic

Skills:

Illusion
Mysticism
Marksman
Alteration
Alchemy
Conjuration
Destruction

It's pretty heavily based on the magic side, and I am going to level up Sneak before the sewers so I am not lacking, and I added more Intelligence skills, because I want a lot of magicka :3

"Now, to test my theory!"

Well, imo, if you are going to have so many magic skills as Major, you'd best take a Breton rather than a High Elf, cos Bretons have magic resistance and High elves have weaknesses to magica, as you know, that can be devastating until you have some magic protection in place. And with those skills it'll take some time to build up your endurance so as to gain more health.
And both Bretons and High Elves have enough magica that you can dispense with birthsigns that add to it, and just take The Thief to enhance your sneakyness.
Mind you, I've used High Elves with all Magic skills as major, plus the Apprentice, and done ok. You just have to be careful!

Whatever you do, have fun!

[galraen]

Nice build Lexeaus except for one thing, Alchemy and Alteration should be minors, for two reasons:

1) You'll likely use it a lot making restore magicka and restore health potions, if it's a major you'll gain levels too quickly

2) Always keep one skill you want the associated attribute increased to the mas outside your majors; that way you can 'top up' before you are forced to level up. If you have all the intelligence and willpower related skills as majors, the most you are likely to be able to increase them by is 3 when you level up. Whereas if you keep Alchemy and Alteration a minors you can make sure you increase Int and wil by 5 each time you level up.

I'd suggest replacing Alchemy and Alteration with skills you never use, but can if you want to, such as hand-to-hand or block/light armour. I tend to use Hand-to-hand and Speechcraft, both are skills that you never have to use, and personality is a total waste anyway. However anytime you want to get those extra couple of major increases to level up they are relatively easy to increase.

PS Don't neglect the power of combination spells, for example Turn undead on touch for ten seconds and 4 fire damage on touch for ten seconds, watch those Zombies run away burning. You could substitute invisibility or demoralise for turn undead of course.

[Lexeaus]

Nice build Lexeaus except for one thing, Alchemy and Alteration should be minors, for two reasons:

1) You'll likely use it a lot making restore magicka and restore health potions, if it's a major you'll gain levels too quickly

2) Always keep one skill you want the associated attribute increased to the mas outside your majors; that way you can 'top up' before you are forced to level up. If you have all the intelligence and willpower related skills as majors, the most you are likely to be able to increase them by is 3 when you level up. Whereas if you keep Alchemy and Alteration a minors you can make sure you increase Int and wil by 5 each time you level up.

I'd suggest replacing Alchemy and Alteration with skills you never use, but can if you want to, such as hand-to-hand or block/light armour. I tend to use Hand-to-hand and Speechcraft, both are skills that you never have to use, and personality is a total waste anyway. However anytime you want to get those extra couple of major increases to level up they are relatively easy to increase.

PS Don't neglect the power of combination spells, for example Turn undead on touch for ten seconds and 4 fire damage on touch for ten seconds, watch those Zombies run away burning. You could substitute invisibility or demoralise for turn undead of course.

Yes, I did decide to move Alchemy to a minor before leaving the sewers

But I kept Alteration, I don't know why, though.

And Fljotsdale, I always tend to be able to get into the Arcane University, so I CAN protect myself with new spells. I don't know about enchanting, I do fancy the idea of running around in nothing but a loincloth and a Red Silk Hood.

[Fljotsdale]

Yes, I did decide to move Alchemy to a minor before leaving the sewers

But I kept Alteration, I don't know why, though.

And Fljotsdale, I always tend to be able to get into the Arcane University, so I CAN protect myself with new spells. I don't know about enchanting, I do fancy the idea of running around in nothing but a loincloth and a Red Silk Hood.

LOL! Nice image! :laugh:

I like Alteration as a Major as well. Useful low, medium and high level Feather spells (Ease Burden, Pack Mule & Beast of Burden) for carting your loot out of dungeons. One reason I like lots of Magica.
I tend to have Mysticism in Major as well, but I really only use it for Spell Reflection/Absorption, Telekinesis, and Soul Trap spells. But I like 'em at high level, so it goes in Major.
Protecting yourself with spells is good and and a High Elf needs to do it often - until she has enchanted clothing to do it for her - then she can use the quick spell slots for other, more useful (imo), spells.
Another skill I like in Major is Armourer, so I can repair magic weapons as soon as possible, although it is less important for a Mage. It takes forever to level it up in minor skills.

[admielke]

My character is...
Level: 19
Race: Breton.
Sign: Thief.
Class: Toxinist (custom) Agility, Willpower.
Alchemy - Extra damage and health, magicka potions.
Alteration - Great traveling spells including feather and open lock.
Marksman - I stick with 1 damage source.
Sneak - Self explanatory.
Restoration - Heals and skill augment spells.
Illusion - Charm, chameleon, invisibility.
Light Armor - Stick with 1 armor.

I was thinking of security but now it's at 88 with no increases.
And armorer for being able to repair magic items. It's only journeyman skill so I'm getting close.
Mysticism only has 1 really good spell: Soul Trap. If you need spell reflect being a sneak marksman then you need to play better. I always 1 or 2 shot kill.
Alchemy can be switched with Mysticism. Alchemy is pretty easy to level up.

With your other question about getting items that increase lower level skills. Do it only when you're leveling it up. Otherwise it's sort of pointless. Since your Destruction is at 31 you'll now have to spam those spells even with +20 skill to level it up but if you only have +5 then you'd have a terribly long time to level it up.

[Lexeaus]

My character is...
Level: 19
Race: Breton.
Sign: Thief.
Class: Toxinist (custom) Agility, Willpower.
Alchemy - Extra damage and health, magicka potions.
Alteration - Great traveling spells including feather and open lock.
Marksman - I stick with 1 damage source.
Sneak - Self explanatory.
Restoration - Heals and skill augment spells.
Illusion - Charm, chameleon, invisibility.
Light Armor - Stick with 1 armor.

I was thinking of security but now it's at 88 with no increases.
And armorer for being able to repair magic items. It's only journeyman skill so I'm getting close.
Mysticism only has 1 really good spell: Soul Trap. If you need spell reflect being a sneak marksman then you need to play better. I always 1 or 2 shot kill.
Alchemy can be switched with Mysticism. Alchemy is pretty easy to level up.

With your other question about getting items that increase lower level skills. Do it only when you're leveling it up. Otherwise it's sort of pointless. Since your Destruction is at 31 you'll now have to spam those spells even with +20 skill to level it up but if you only have +5 then you'd have a terribly long time to level it up.

Nice, I guess, but I do't know which specialty I should build up more of, Sneak or Magic... It is a hard decision, I must say...