A long expected party

Sailor Saturn · Post by **Sailor Saturn** » Mon Dec 10, 2001 6:04 pm

Originally posted by Dottie:
Eowyn have already been mentioned so i wont rant about her, but a strong femal character that always seems to be forgotten is Lobelia. And this is sad since i think she is one of the more complex characters in LoTR.

I mean, Arwen is a dull bimbo in comparison

Lobelia?

der Moench · Post by **der Moench** » Mon Dec 10, 2001 6:19 pm

Originally posted by Lazarus:
YEAH! Another part of that chapter that I love is when Eomer thinks that Theoden and Eowyn are dead, and turns back heedlessly into battle. I can't quote verbatim (and don't have my book handy), but it is beautiful.

I like the Galadriel scene as well. It has been previewed in the trailers, and it looks like the movie does it justice.

Being a monk, scribing is in my nature!

SPOILER!

Here is some of Eomer's headlong rush into battle after seeing the "death" of Eowyn and Theoden.

"But Eomer said to them:

Mourn not overmuch! Mighty was the fallen,
Meet was his ending. When his mound is raised,
Women then shall weep. War now calls us!

Yet he himself wept as he spoke. ‘Let his knights remain here,’ he said, ‘and bear his body in honour from the field, lest the battle ride over it! Yea, and all these other of the king’s men that lie here.’ And he looked at the slain, recalling their names. Then suddenly he beheld his sister Eowyn as she lay, and he knew her. He stood a moment as a man who is pierced in the midst of a cry by an arrow through the heart; and then his face went deathly white, and a cold fury rose in him, so that all speech failed him for a while. A fey mood took him.

‘Eowyn, Eowyn!’ he cried at last. ‘Eowyn, how come you here? What madness or devilry is this? Death, death, death! Death take us all!’

Then wihtout taking counsel or waiting for the approach of the men of the City, he spurred headlong back to the front of the great host, and blew a horn, and cried aloud for the onset. Over the field rang his clear voice calling: ‘Death! Ride, ride to ruin and the world’s ending!’

And with that the host began to move. But the Rohirrim sang no more. Death they cried with one voice loud and terrible, and gathering speed like a great tide their battle swept about their fallen king and passed, roaring away southwards.

…

For Eomer was now scarcely a mile from the Harlond, and a great press of his first foes was between him and the haven there, while new foes came swirling behind, cutting him off from the Prince. Now he looked to the River, and hope died in his heart, and the wind that he had blessed he now called accursed. But the hosts of Mordor were enheartened, and filled with a new lust and fury they came yelling to the onset.

Stern now was Eomers mood, and his mind clear again. He let blow the horns to rally all men to his banner that could come thither; for he thought to make a great shield-wall at the last, and stand, and fight there on foot till all fell, and do deeds of song on the fields of Pelennor, though no man should be left in the West to remember the last King of the Mark. So he rode to a green hillock and there set his banner, and the White Horse ran rippling in the wind.

Out of doubt, out of dark to the day’s rising
I came singing in the sun, sword unsheathing.
To hope’s end I rode and to heart’s breaking:
Now for wrath, now for ruin and a red nightfall!

These staves he spoke, yet he laughed as he said them. For once more lust of battle was on him; and he was still unscathed, and he was young, and he was king: the lord of a fell people. And lo! even as he laughed at despair he looked out again on the black ships, and he lifted up his sword to defy them."

THAT is some seriously cool writing! All praise Tolkien!

EDIT: for layout - and one spelling error

[ 12-10-2001: Message edited by: der Moench ]

EMINEM · Post by **EMINEM** » Mon Dec 10, 2001 7:22 pm

IMO, Tolkien's best writing was realized in the beginning of Two Towers, after the breaking of the fellowship and the pursuit of the orcs by Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas. There are no Pelennorian battle scenes here, no "YOU... SHALL... NOT... PASS!!!" shouts of defiance, but rather a swift flowing narrative that simultaneously fulfills all three elements of good writing; reveal character, create atmosphere, advance plot. Tolkien made it look too easy.

der Moench · Post by **der Moench** » Mon Dec 10, 2001 7:25 pm

He made it ALL look easy!

humanflyz · Post by **humanflyz** » Mon Dec 10, 2001 9:24 pm

How is Lobelia an important female character?

Another favorite passage of mine is when Sam battles Shelob. Throughout the beginning of the book, Sam is portrayed like a faithful servant, but somewhat timid, but extremely loyal. This is the first time that Sam fully reveals his true character. He shows that he can be brave and can handle the situation when the need arises. Unlike Frodo, who is educated and know something of the Elder Days, Sam does not know alot about the elves and ancient history, instead, he possesses a lot of "hobbit sense" as the Gaffer calls it. Sam does not rely on knowledge, instead, he relies on common sense and his heart. He says a lot of things that surprises many of the Wise. I think Sam shows that the Wise cannot know everything and courage comes from the most unexpected.

scully1 · Post by **scully1** » Tue Dec 11, 2001 8:34 am

Originally posted by Dottie:
Eowyn have already been mentioned so i wont rant about her, but a strong femal character that always seems to be forgotten is Lobelia. And this is sad since i think she is one of the more complex characters in LoTR.

I mean, Arwen is a dull bimbo in comparison

Ack, how could I forget Eowyn?? She is one of my favorites. "Nonexistent" was the wrong word; I should've said "few & far between"

But Eowyn won't come in until the second movie, if I'm not mistaken?? I think they might have wanted to introduce a strong female character early on, as a kind of hook, hence the meatier role for Arwen...Also since they're elaborating on the romance, it's necessary to give us a little more of Arwen than we get from the books.

scully1 · Post by **scully1** » Tue Dec 11, 2001 8:49 am

Originally posted by humanflyz:
How is Lobelia an important female character?

"'Why, they even took Pimple's old ma, that Lobelia, and he was fond of her, if no one else was. Some of the Hobbiton folk, they saw it. She comes down the lane with her old umbrella. Some of the ruffians were going up with a big cart.

"Where be you a-going?" says she.

"To Bag End," says they.

"What for?" says she.

"To put up some sheds for Sharkey," says they.

"Who said you could?" says she.

"Sharkey," says they. "So get out o'the road, ole hagling!"

"I'll give you Sharkey, you dirty thieving ruffians!" says she, and ups with her umbrella and goes for the leader, near twice her size. So they took her. Dragged her off to the Lockholes, at her age too. They've took others we miss more, but there's no denying she showed more spirit than most.'"...

..."Then there was Lobelia. Poor thing, she looked very old and thin when they rescued her from a dark and narrow cell. She insisted on hobbling out on her own feet, and she had such a welcome, and there was such clapping and cheering when she appeared, leaning on Frodo's arm but still clutching her umbrella, that she was quite touched, and drove away in tears. She had never been popular before...

When the poor creature died next Spring -- she was after all more than a hundred years old -- Frodo was surprised and much moved: she had left all that remained of her money and of Lotho's for him to use in helping hobbits made homeless by the troubles. So the feud was ended."

Might not further the plot, but a remarkable character. I was sad to hear that Lobelia will not be in the movies, only Lotho.

[ 12-11-2001: Message edited by: loner72 ]

Dottie · Post by **Dottie** » Tue Dec 11, 2001 11:05 am

Originally posted by Sailor Saturn:
Lobelia?

Loner said it all.

Originally posted by humanflyz:
How is Lobelia an important female character?

I didnt say she was important, just one of the better characters.

@Loner: Eowyn is one of my favourits aswell... and if lobelia aint made it into the movie she wont have any competition at all

humanflyz · Post by **humanflyz** » Tue Dec 11, 2001 9:18 pm

I just want to see Liv Tyler.

I think she looks better with the sharp elven ears.

Sailor Saturn · Post by **Sailor Saturn** » Tue Dec 11, 2001 11:42 pm

Originally posted by Dottie:
Loner said it all.

Okay. I thought that might be who, but I wasn't sure.

Georgi · Post by **Georgi** » Wed Dec 12, 2001 5:16 am

Back on the subject of the movie, what I've heard since the premiere Monday night is sounding very promising indeed...

One week to go!

EMINEM · Post by **EMINEM** » Wed Dec 12, 2001 8:45 pm

Six days to go!

I've read most of the reviews ([url="http://www.theonering.net/"]http://www.theonering.net/[/url] is probably the best website out there) and even the dumbest, least imaginative critics can't hide their astonishment at what they've experienced (and what we Tolkenites and D&Dians have been in love with for years).

It's hard to believe it, folks, but it looks like the author and perfector of our faith is about to go mainstream!

That's three smilies for the Flamer kings of electronic mail

Seven for the Lurker lords in their basement homes

Nine for aspiring SYMians doomed to fail

One for the Spam Lord on his Spam Throne

In the GB forums where the shadows lie

One smilie to rule them all, one smilie to find them
One smilie to bring them all
And in this message board bind them

In the GB forums where the shadows lie

[ 12-12-2001: Message edited by: EMINEM ]

scully1 · Post by **scully1** » Wed Dec 12, 2001 8:53 pm

The only thing is, I've seen critics writing things like "Tolkien's vast, complex mythology" and "If you don't completely understand all of it right away, you're going to be lost." Seems to me like that would turn a lot of people off right away

Teroril · Post by **Teroril** » Thu Dec 13, 2001 1:32 am

Hi I'm currently reading the book (haven't gotten far yet!!), but i'm reading it in english (i am danish) becouse i think that i will have a better experience from both the books and the movies when i'm doing this!!!!

scully1 · Post by **scully1** » Thu Dec 13, 2001 8:41 am

@Teoril: Good idea. So much great literature suffers through translation into other languages...

EMINEM · Post by **EMINEM** » Thu Dec 13, 2001 3:04 pm

LoTR reviews are pouring in. This one, from the L.A. Times, I found rather good, and may serve to encapsulate how some Tolkien lovers feel about seeing their favorite author "go Hollywood."

[url="http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/front/la-000098984dec13.story?coll=la%2Dheadlines%2Dfrontpage"]Click here[/url]

Kayless · Post by **Kayless** » Thu Dec 13, 2001 7:30 pm

Originally posted by EMINEM:
There are no Pelennorian battle scenes here, no "YOU... SHALL... NOT... PASS!!!" shouts of defiance, but rather a swift flowing narrative that simultaneously fulfills all three elements of good writing; reveal character, create atmosphere, advance plot.

Funny, Gandalf's confrontation with the Balrog of Moria is one of my favorite scenes. (and it's 'cannot' pass instead of 'shall' not pass

).

"You cannot pass."... "I am a servant of the Secret Fire, Wielder of the Flame of Anor, You cannot pass. The dark fire will not avail you, Flame of Udun. Go Back to the Shadow! You cannot pass."

Does anyone else have the soundtrack? I think it's great.

EMINEM · Post by **EMINEM** » Fri Dec 14, 2001 8:11 am

5 days to go, and counting.

In the meantime, here's some Tolkien trivia centred upon the Lord of the Ring and the One Ring itself:

1. How many rings in total did Sauron create? (think back to the opening poem)

2. What were the names of the three Elven rings? What precious stones were set in them?

3. Who wore them?

4. Who was Sauron's master?

5. Who cut the ring off Sauron's finger? What was the name of the instrument he used to do so?

6. Other than casting them into Orodruin (Mount Doom), how else can the great rings be destroyed?

7. Who was the last Ringbearer to leave Middle-Earth?

8. What riddle/question did Bilbo use to win the One Ring from Gollum?

9. What two "beneficial" powers does the One Ring grants its wearer?

10. Who was the first person to become aware of the One Ring's existence when Sauron placed it upon his finger?

Good luck, and no surfing the net for answers!

Score:

1-3 Fool of a Took!

4-6 Congratulations! You scored higher than Biff (see Death of a Salesmen)

7-9 What LoTR character will you be dressed up as at the premier?

10 Expect Saruman to ask you to become his ally.

McBane · Post by **McBane** » Fri Dec 14, 2001 8:26 am

So has anyone bought tickets yet? I picked up some yesterday. I was surprised that there were plenty available for opening day.

Nightmare · Post by **Nightmare** » Fri Dec 14, 2001 3:16 pm

1. 20
2. Haven't a clue.

3. ditto
4. Morgoroth (sp?)
5. Isuldur?
6. A dragon's breath?
7. huh?
8. "What is in my pocket?"

9. Invisibility... and... uh...

10. ?

Well, thats three sure ones off the top of my head...

Fool of a Took!