Is Viconia's alignment deserved?

Vendetta · Post by **Vendetta** » Wed May 16, 2001 12:46 pm

@jennabard - It seems to be random who pipes up during the beggar scene.
But when Viconia does, she tells the Guard to stop bothering old beggars and asks him where he was when she was almost lynched by fanatics.
Someone else in the party will point out how very "Un-Drow like" this is and if you have Haer'Dalis, he will insinuate Viconia is putting on an "evil" act.

If Viconia's alignment does change, I think Chaotic Neutral would be most believable, because, stereotypically, they have erratic and unpredictable personalities.
Since Viconia tends to switch between "bitch" and "non-bitch" when she lets her emotional guard down, it seems more appropriate than a "good" alignment. She seems a million miles away from the other Good Aligned characters such as Aerie, Nalia or Keldorn.

Wycen Adamantite · Post by **Wycen Adamantite** » Wed May 16, 2001 12:55 pm

I don't think chaotic neutral would be for her. First, she's have to swing away both from evil and neutral. From neutral evil to True neutral I can see though. She can still be self centered and not care about what happens to those around her.

Drakron Du´Dark · Post by **Drakron Du´Dark** » Wed May 16, 2001 1:20 pm

Originally posted by Wycen Adamantite:
... She can still be self centered and not care about what happens to those around her.

Also know as the Neutral Evil aligment.
I said this before, any of the evil aligments dont mean that the NPC that have that aligment is going around killing people, not even the Chaotic Evil (But most chaotic evil are murders), it means a lot of things, a Lawful Evil is diferent from Lawful Good by the fact that a Lawful Good trys that the laws help people as a Lawful Evil trys that the Laws help him but BOTH belive in the law, a lawful good and a Lawful evil will keep the word that they give ,same thing for the others aligments.
Viconia is neutral evil because she is only conserned about herself and not the others, the fact is that even a Neutral Evil can do what Viconia did in the Underdark that lead to the fall of her house, as long that it does not became the NPC usual tendancies (Viconia always trying to help people) it does not require a aligment change.

Wycen Adamantite · Post by **Wycen Adamantite** » Wed May 16, 2001 1:44 pm

*Shrugs shoulders* Everyone has a different idea of how/what the alignments work.

xFedaykin · Post by **xFedaykin** » Wed May 16, 2001 10:19 pm

good and evil arent always...

good and evil

Quecty · Post by **Quecty** » Wed May 16, 2001 11:35 pm

Originally posted by xFedaykin:
good and evil arent always...

good and evil

True enough.Take Keldorn,for example.This is a man dedicated to upholding the principles of honour.Yet,upon learning that his wife has been seeing another man,and if left to his own devices,has the guy executed and his wife thrown into prison ("Curse the dictates of honour..."),and abandons his children ("The Order is all I have now...").Lawful Evil,anyone?

Ben_Albright · Post by **Ben_Albright** » Thu May 17, 2001 6:31 pm

I think that Viconia has risen alot from the basic drow evilness. She does make a few acts that seem to lead twoards good. I believe that she is slowly moving away form her evil drow upbringing and moving twoards good. She was raised evil and could not argue, but now that she has viewed the world her opinions could change. Even though she did comit several evil acts throughout the game changing alignment is never a one shot deal. She will comit more good actions and less evil actions as she move twoards good.

As for chaotic neutrel, that would be a double change, neutrel to chaos and evil to neutrel, true neutrel could probably set in first, but neutrel good would probably be the end result. That is if their is an alignment change.

polaris · Post by **polaris** » Sun Jul 22, 2001 7:02 pm

I know for a fact that with the appropriate dialog you can change Viconia's alignment to T-N....and she becomes a *much* more bearable person after the switch (in ToB). I tried to get her to go to N-G, but I don't think this is possible. Remember she worships Shal, a distinctly NON-good diety.

-Polaris

rapier · Post by **rapier** » Sun Jul 22, 2001 7:30 pm

Originally posted by polaris:

Remember she worships Shal, a distinctly NON-good diety.

Shar...Night, Darkness, Underdark, IIRC...Not necessarily evil, eh?

Also, it is pretty understandable that she is Neutral Evil...the only person she ever loved and trusted was killed because of her. she was betrayed and mistreated everytime she let her guard down, no wonder she's a bitch. In the romance the PC shows her concepts like love and trust, and, if followed correctly, she begins trusting him and becomes much more bearable...

polaris · Post by **polaris** » Sun Jul 22, 2001 7:33 pm

Shar represents night, dark, and also entropy and death. I *NEVER* said that Shar was evil. I *said* she was distinctly non-good and I stand by that. Look her up. Shar can not (IIRC) have good aligned clerics (but neutral ones are ok). Cernd expounds on this in one of his dialogs with Viconia.

-Polaris

rapier · Post by **rapier** » Sun Jul 22, 2001 7:37 pm

I did...
*snip*
Shar (Greater Power)
Dark, night, loss, forgetfulness, unrevealed secrets, caverns, dungeons, the Underdark

Alignment NE
Worshippers Any, but mainly evil
*snip*

glory · Post by **glory** » Sun Jul 22, 2001 10:37 pm

I think that it is possible for Viconia's alignment to change...it all depends on if she decides to change it or not. Just like in life...our experiences changes us as we grow...i mean look at drizzt, he's drow yet he became chaotic good.

polaris · Post by **polaris** » Sun Jul 22, 2001 10:43 pm

It *is* possible for Viconia's alignment to change (in ToB). I have done it.

***SPOILER ALERT*****

After you wipe out Yaga Shura, Viconia *congratulates* you on having so much death done in your name. If you were romancing here, and you slap her down *hard* (i.e. since when have I *ever* enjoyed killing people), you start a string of dialogs that will get Viconia to change to T-N and a much more bearable NPC. I don't think, however, it is possible to get here to N-G.

-Polaris

KaaZe · Post by **KaaZe** » Sun Jul 22, 2001 10:51 pm

When I first played the game I was sure that Viconia would be a new Drizzt in some way, maybe abit more neutral then Drizzt. But her actions at the start of BG2 and her alignemnt I see no problem with. He has not had one good experience with a surface dweller except the PC. Just look what happens to her if you dont save her, in BG1, killed/hanged by the flaming fist for crimes she didnt commit(Im guessing here). BG2 burned by fanatics because she is... tada.. Drow. If that doesnt make you care more about your self then your "fellow" man, I dont know what does. Viconia is the kid that needs a chance, a fair shot at life on the surface and YOU are the only one that can give her this. This is, IMHO, what makes this particular romance much more interresting, you are defending your way of life. Trying show someone who have lost all faith in surface society, that there is hope and not everyone will judge her by the color of her skin.... unfortunenally, everyone does except you. The comments Viconia throws that your party memebers is a attempt by her to get to know them. I think that Keldorns reaction towards Viconia is totally out of character, Viconia simply questions that rightness of his order. After that, Keldorn desides to kill her. But you are child of Bhaal, a seed of evil, does Keldorn react just alittle negative towards you... nope, nada.. just gives a speech about guiding you to the right path. The only real NPC fight I can understand is Minsc Vs. Edwin, for ovious reasons.

Well, just my ranter on this subject.. Viconia is always a part of my party, because she is a great cleric and has some very interrestin subject's of disscussion.