Party problems (sp?)

Erenor · Post by **Erenor** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 10:31 am

Yeah, it definately sucks that some NPCs don't get along, but it makes perfect sense. I'm surprised that Minsc doesn't beat the stuffing out of Edwin as soon as he sees him, considering he is still mourning the loss of Dynaheir and Edwin was always trying to kill her. Keldorn and any Drow other than Drizzt probably wouldn't work anyway, b/c he's older and stubborn in his Paladin ways. Does this Mod fix just remove fights or does it remove the dialogue as well?

krunchyfrogg · Post by **krunchyfrogg** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 3:34 pm

[QUOTE=Astafas]Well now, in order for it to be cheating you would have to gain some kind of advantage, don't you agree? It's not like the fights are there to prevent certain unstoppable NPC combinations... In addition, I think you will second me on that the most important is for each player to have the game they desire, and kams didn't seem to happy about the current situation.[/QUOTE]

Cheating is breaking the rules, IMHO. As many people think Viconia is the best Cleric out there, then having a mod that changes the original rules, allowing Keldorn and her to be in the same party IS "some kind of advantage."

Thrifalas · Post by **Thrifalas** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:27 pm

I agree, of cource it is some kind of advantage, but just one of those that makes the game a lil' more fun when you've already played it through a couple of times. It's not like we're looking for challenges unless we try some strange solo-class or get some tactic-mods.

There's nothing wrong in cheating in a manner that enhances the rpg-feeling imho, if that's what you're looking for in a game. But, still cheating.

Aramant · Post by **Aramant** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 7:29 am

[QUOTE=Thrifalas]There's nothing wrong in cheating in a manner that enhances the rpg-feeling imho, if that's what you're looking for in a game. [/QUOTE]

I would think that inter-character conflict would enhance the feeling of roleplay rather than a mod that just shuts up the NPCs.

Thrifalas · Post by **Thrifalas** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 8:13 am

True, my mistake, I meant if it enhances the funniness of the game. After all, it's not like anyone get in trouble for cheating like in so many online games, this one is purely for our own fun.

Astafas · Post by **Astafas** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 8:26 am

[QUOTE=krunchyfrogg]Cheating is breaking the rules, IMHO. As many people think Viconia is the best Cleric out there, then having a mod that changes the original rules, allowing Keldorn and her to be in the same party IS "some kind of advantage."[/QUOTE]

So if I don't think Vic is the best Cleric out there (which I don't), then I don't get any advantage? The advantage (and the cheating) would in other words depend on your personal preferences?

Another opinion: The tactic of initiating a dialogue with a non hostile monster and then attacking (while they still wait for what you're gonna say, thus not attacking you) does not conflict with any "rule" in BG2. I would still consider it cheating though.

Thrifalas · Post by **Thrifalas** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 9:36 am

It's about wether you use them or not. You don't have to think that Vic is the best cleric to use her, but you will get the advantage if being able to mix your parties any way you want anyway.

And for the second, it sure doesn't conflict with any rule, but the game has an almost unlimited selection of cheesing do to if you want, and everything that really isn't supposed to happen is by me considered cheating.

But then again, we all just play for our own fun, so everyone shouls suit themselves.

Astafas · Post by **Astafas** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 1:18 pm

[QUOTE=Thrifalas]It's about wether you use them or not. You don't have to think that Vic is the best cleric to use her, but you will get the advantage if being able to mix your parties any way you want anyway[/QUOTE]

This makes absolutely no sense. If we for the argument's sake agree on that Vic is weaker than Anomen, what kind of advantage would I have by using her together with Keldorn.

(Another mix that won't go well is Minsc and Edwin. Lots of people hold Edwin as the best Mage in the game, but few would argue for that Minsc is the best Warrior. So what would be the advantage of having him instead of a better Warrior like Korgan?)

Thrifalas · Post by **Thrifalas** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 1:37 pm

Even if it won't give you an edge in combat, having two characters in your party that you're not really allowed to must be considered an advantage, how small it might be.

But yes, point taken, I'm not saying that it's like a big cheat or that you becomes invincible when doing it...

Wabbit · Post by **Wabbit** » Sun May 08, 2005 2:49 am

I am playing a game with no paladin, and with Haer Dalis picking up Carsomyr (currently in Saradush). Haer Dalis is one of the 3 front-line fighters in the party and I would not say he is "effective" with Carsomyr particularly. He can use it, yes, and he has proficiency in it, but the number of attacks is what kills it.

Bards only get 1 attack, which is not enough in HTH combat in the game. With Carsomyr or any 2 hander weapon (for instance, a halberd), Haer Dalis gets 1 attack. He can use offensive spin and get an extra attack (and bonuses and max damage on each hit), which is what makes it acceptable in certain situations. Alternately, you can cast a improved haste on HD, which will also net 2 attacks....so no big difference. Tensor's, although excellent for a bard, also does not increase number of attacks.

2 attacks per round with Carsomyr is no joke, but Haer Dalis and other bards do better dual-wielding, especially if they have one of the "extra attack" weapons like Belm +2 or that +3 monk sword one of the bonus merchants has.

For regular fighting, I have Haer-Dalis use the extra-attack monk sword in the off-hand and then Celestial Fury or some other good sword like Purifier in the main hand. This nets 3 attacks per round, 4 with offensive spin, 5 with improved haste. He does pretty well with this, as long as he has some protections up.

Compare that to a real paladin or a pretender fighter/thief using Carsomyr with 10 attack/round greater whirlwind, or 3 attacks per round with no hasting at higher levels, and it is clear that Haer Dalis cannot keep up with the real fighters with a 2-handed weapon. However, he can certainly use Carsomyr to good advantage in certain circumstances, like killing mages. The 50% magic resistance is worth it in itself anyway, and if you don't have a paladin it's worth getting anyone you can to wield Carsomyr just for that.....even Jan.

SP101 · Post by **SP101** » Sun May 08, 2005 3:38 am

[QUOTE=Wabbit] The 50% magic resistance is worth it in itself anyway, and if you don't have a paladin it's worth getting anyone you can to wield Carsomyr just for that.....even Jan.[/QUOTE]

I'm 100% with your last point.

When Keldorn isn't in my party, Jan is wearing Carsomyr just for the Magic Resistance (50% MR is a HUGE Bonus), and Firetooth for when he's not casting (0,005% of the time). This makes Jan almost impervious to spells, while casting his owns against our enemies.

SP101 · Post by **SP101** » Sun May 08, 2005 3:39 am

[QUOTE=Kam]A bard can use Carsomir??? Wow! I have Haer'Dalis now! A little training - and everyone will know the fury of Kams the Terrible!

But there is one thing that sucks - I already sold the sword to a merchant. And I don't remember which one...
Well, I am off - I need to find this merchant and buy the sword back. If I remember correctly, I sold it to someone in Trademeet (or perhaps, Umar Hills???)... This will take some time...[/QUOTE]

If it's a merchant your can pickpocket, just *glup* a few potions of Master Thievery with your thief (or with Haer'D.) to get it back for free...