Druids get totaly SCREW-ED

Astafas · Post by **Astafas** » Fri Sep 07, 2001 12:39 am

Originally posted by UserUnfriendly:
Seriously, anoweenie is just not worth it, he's dual class, wwhich rocks in SOA, but the real power chars in tob is multiclass. its tough getting the levels, but aerie and jaheira become uber killers at high levels, the ability to pick from 2 pools of high level abilities makes for evil combinations....

What you're saying here is actually that single classes aren't worth it. Anomen is an "enhanced" Cleric: More HPs, higher STR and so on. For these advantages he let go of a few XPs. Considering the amount of XPs you get in SoA and ToB, that can't be considered a real disadvantage. And that loss of XP is the *only* "negative" thing that seperates him from a single class Cleric.

Xyx · Post by **Xyx** » Fri Sep 07, 2001 6:33 am

*slightly off-topic*

Indeed, if you think dual classers are weak, then what about single classers?

On a slightly related note... How could Ano ever dual to Cleric with such a mediocre Wisdom?

Off on another tangent... ToB Druids have been seriously cheesed up with extra spells and the ability to even advance to higher levels. AD&D Druids get stuck at level 16 and have the same spell progression Clerics do.

Astafas · Post by **Astafas** » Fri Sep 07, 2001 7:20 am

Originally posted by Xyx:
*slightly off-topic*
On a slightly related note... How could Ano ever dual to Cleric with such a mediocre Wisdom?

Possibly the in same way as Aerie (an elf) managed to become a Mage/Cleric. Maybe it's a step towards the more liberal rules of 3:d Ed. Well at least he can get a WIS boost pretty early.

Rodo · Post by **Rodo** » Fri Sep 07, 2001 7:46 am

OFF TOPIC (so don't yell at me)

If we're on the topic of 3e, I recently saw the special abilities druids and monks gain at the higher levels and I have to say they are incredibly amazing.
Monks becoming classified as an outsider with 20/+1 reduction anyone?
Druids gaining the ability to change not just into animals/elementals but to also change thier very humanoid appearance (not to mention some of the really nifty druid spells)

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 12:26 pm

ok ok then sheilds

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 12:28 pm

Originally posted by Astafas:
Possibly the in same way as Aerie (an elf) managed to become a Mage/Cleric. Maybe it's a step towards the more liberal rules of 3:d Ed. Well at least he can get a WIS boost pretty early.

She was raised by a gnome and took on a gnomish caerer

Xyx · Post by **Xyx** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 4:44 pm

A protagonist Demi-Human is raised by a Human (Gorion), but still cannot dual-class... Unnecessary deviation from PnP rules (Aerie's/Anomen's classes) smells like blatant, DM-approved powergaming to me.

Something like convincing your DM to let you play Half-Dragon/Half-Nymph or something.

UserUnfriendly · Post by **UserUnfriendly** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 10:50 pm

Half dragon. half nymph?

Seriously cute, but takes HUGE stinky dumps!

Sorry, about the dual class.
I do line single classes, due to the really nice kits.

dual does cut into the exp cap of the second class, but my biggest objection is that you get the low level abilities of the first class, unless you dual really late, but cannot get the high level quest abilities of the first class. those high level abilities are what makes any class wrecking machines. for example, a fighter mage multi can use greater whirlwind and tensors transform and black blade of disaster.

a kensai mage dual can use kai, tensors and black blade, I'd rather get the greater whirlwind, more useful than kai. The way I see it, you're tading off the ceiling for your second class for the low level abilities of the first. and while they are nice, they are not as powerful as a well selected multi.

Astafas · Post by **Astafas** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 12:26 am

Originally posted by craig:
She was raised by a gnome and took on a gnomish caerer[/QB]

Sure, but that's still not by the book.

[ 09-12-2001: Message edited by: Astafas ]

Xyx · Post by **Xyx** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 8:18 am

Originally posted by UserUnfriendly:
I do line single classes, due to the really nice kits.

If you like kits, why wouldn't you like duals? The biggest advantage of a dual over a multi is that they get to pick a kit.

IMHO there is no single class that does not benefit greatly from a dual.

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 10:23 am

cleric?

Xyx · Post by **Xyx** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 2:58 pm

Berserker/Cleric? Ranger/Cleric?

UserUnfriendly · Post by **UserUnfriendly** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 6:26 pm

So dual trades low ceiling in first type, like fighter dual to mage, for the ability to pick a kit?

The kits are great at the high levels, but there are great multis that will compensate quite nicely for the ability to pick a kit.

I will absolutely admit, though, that the wizardslayer thief dual is pure munchkin madness!

Too evil, too evil!!

Ok, with a few exceptions, the low level kit abilities don't compare to two high level pools of picks to choose from!

Perfect power bash party,

myslef, sorc
aerie
jaheira
jan

harry

not a multi, but the blade kits are really multi classes in disguise.

but I hate jan, and harry is after my girl, so no go.

currently playing

me
sorc
minsc
viccy
aerie
jaheira
yoshimo

I know, I should have gotten korgan, but minsc is fun to play!

Lots of cat fighting going on now, as soon I will choose viccy.

caddyman · Post by **caddyman** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 8:12 pm

I JUST STARTED PLAYING AS THE WIZARDSLAYA/THEIF BUT I CANT FIND THE GUY TO MAKE THE HUMAN FLESH ARMOUR I THOUGHT HE WAS IN UMAR HILLS BUT IF SOMEONE COULD GIMMIE BETTER DIRECTIONS I WOULD BE VERY GREATFUL

UserUnfriendly · Post by **UserUnfriendly** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 9:32 pm

Got this from some faq, I cant remember where.
OTHER: Fael and the Human Flesh Armor

Fael - Umar Hills (AR 1100, x 3500 y 2850)

If you solved the murders in the Bridge District you may have ended
out with an incomplete set of human flesh armor. There was also a
note that told you how to contact the person who was to finish the
armor, one Fael who is currently in the Umar Hills area. You'll
find him with the other merchants. Talk to him and buy the History
of the Zhentarim. Then tell him his name, 5) Darcin Cole and he
says that all he needs is one final ingredient, the blood of a
silver dragon. You won't find a Silver Dragon for QUITE some time,
but you will run into one eventually. Can't miss her. Bring him
the blood and he'll finish you the armor (Leather AC 3, magic
resistance 20%).

Oh, and he'll recognize that you aren't the Tanner and call in some
mages to attack you. Therefore this is best done at night when the
merchants are indoors and won't get blown to bits by the mages.

I also plan to get human flesh for vicy. kinda makes my flesh creep to think someone I am bedding is wearing tha. and in tob she can become neutral, so that blows.

Xyx · Post by **Xyx** » Thu Sep 13, 2001 2:31 am

Originally posted by UserUnfriendly:
So dual trades low ceiling in first type, like fighter dual to mage, for the ability to pick a kit?

There's more to it. Fighter/Mage dual gets all Fighter's Hit Point rolls and Con bonuses, so easily has 100+ Hit Points by the time they get to level 9. The multi does not nearly get that much.

Duals also progress much faster in their second class. At 3 mil XP, you have a capped out Mage with 9 levels of Fighter. If you dual, you need almost 6 mil to get that far in the Mage class.

Originally posted by caddyman:
I JUST STARTED PLAYING AS THE WIZARDSLAYA/THEIF BUT I CANT FIND THE GUY TO MAKE THE HUMAN FLESH ARMOUR I THOUGHT HE WAS IN UMAR HILLS BUT IF SOMEONE COULD GIMMIE BETTER DIRECTIONS I WOULD BE VERY GREATFUL

Oooh, Caps Lock got stuck?

Originally posted by UserUnfriendly:
Got this from some faq, I cant remember where.

Dan Simpson's. Probably from [url="http://www.gamefaqs.com"]GameFAQs[/url].

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Thu Sep 13, 2001 5:38 am

And the sheilds? only 2 legit ones available, buckler and buckler +1

Loredweller · Post by **Loredweller** » Fri Sep 14, 2001 11:33 am

Bah, if you don't like true druids, just dual to druid from your fighter right at the start. You can use any armor and shield then. The question about one-hand weapon is still here, though. Staff-mace fits at the begining (after Irenicus dungeon), for one thing, nevertheless assortiment of clubs, spears and scimitars is very limited.

UserUnfriendly · Post by **UserUnfriendly** » Fri Sep 14, 2001 12:15 pm

True, the hit point bonuses are nice, but

ring of gaxx

axe of unyeilding

belt of fortitude!

Really, as long as a char is above 60,regeneration items make hit point fairly moot. so does staff of resurrection. Just keep an eye out, and caast resurrect when a char is about to bit e it. It works FAST!!!!

Much faster than drinking a potion.

why 60?

power word kill!

any way, Xyx, my point is not whether a dual is great, cause it is, as long as you make sure that your second class is the one you want BAD, but that in terms of power the dual can not become uber munchkin later on. will soon post my ultimate soa party, a nd once again blow my saves. sigh.

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Fri Sep 14, 2001 12:18 pm

Can you say Elf?