demogorgon in watchers keep

Kane · Post by **Kane** » Tue Oct 09, 2001 12:46 pm

Im torn between taking the easy option (wasting Demogorgon from outside) and going back in to save watsis name.
Does anyone know about treasure etc for killing old DG is it worth it ?
I must admit ive tried a few times to no avail.

incandescent one · Post by **incandescent one** » Tue Oct 09, 2001 12:51 pm

There's no valuable treasure in the encounter.

(P.S. Does anyone else feel weird when saying that a collection of +2 maces, and plate mail is called worthless ?)

Kane · Post by **Kane** » Tue Oct 09, 2001 12:59 pm

Chears.
Is it worth Exp. wise etc.

go on spoil me.

The fallen one · Post by **The fallen one** » Tue Oct 09, 2001 1:31 pm

Originally posted by transcendent two:
There's no valuable treasure in the encounter.

(P.S. Does anyone else feel weird when saying that a collection of +2 maces, and plate mail is called worthless ?)

I feel this way as well. I was not grabbing +3 swords anymore just leaving them lying around like they were garbage. Imagine items like that in the first one.

Disco Stew · Post by **Disco Stew** » Tue Oct 09, 2001 4:53 pm

It doesn't matter what you choose, but try to roleplay to your alignment. good characters will imprison demo, neatrals will just kill him, adn evil will trick the knights then kill him.

You're having trouble with him? On core rules I took him out on the first try with a blast from a wand of spell striking and two tanks using greater whirlwinds.

As long as you have two tanks that have hit the thac0 cap (base thac0 of 0) and have greater whirlwind the fight should be a peice of cake. The y'tossi should be delt with afterwards, and IMO they are far harder than demo.

Good Luck!

UserUnfriendly · Post by **UserUnfriendly** » Tue Oct 09, 2001 11:33 pm

doesn't the full eng patch for tob drop a gold and silver ioun stone for demogorgy any more???

gold is worthless, does +1 int increase, whoopdy doo... but hte silver is kick ass!!!for chars like jaheria or aerie that extra point of wisdom means extra spells!!!

Luther · Post by **Luther** » Thu Oct 11, 2001 10:10 am

Warning: spoiler ahead:

Personally, I was a little disappointed with the Demogorgon encounter. I mean, you go all that way just to read a scroll, *convienently* get the opportunity to escape, and then *convienently* some ghost shows up to give you the real scroll. It's way too easy! To go the good route, you don't even need to see the beast! I wonder how many of the artists who slaved away at perfecting DG's every hideous detail were aghast when the writers gave that option.

I can't bring myself to go that easy route, I gotta kill him. My question is, is the XP the same? Better?

Xyx · Post by **Xyx** » Thu Oct 11, 2001 11:42 am

I somehow wouldn't feel good simply reading that scroll...

Must be insecurity that drives me to fight him.

Rob-hin · Post by **Rob-hin** » Fri Oct 12, 2001 9:24 am

Yeah! Why pass out the chance to fight the Prince of Demons???
It's one of the things that make the game fun, not doeing it makes no sense what so ever...

Luther · Post by **Luther** » Fri Oct 12, 2001 10:07 am

I just took out DG and I'm sorry, but he was a total wuss. My characters were in the 16-27 level range (multi and single class respectively) , but I figured he should be something like level 50. Just like Disco said above, a couple blasts from the wand of spell striking and some whirlwinding tanks took him out before I could even hit my spell triggers for my mages. He just collapsed like a card house. It was pathetic. A couple more blasts from the wands killed the marileths protections and they went down the next round. (It was funny when the staff of ram threw one all the way across the room!)

I didn't even get the chance to see his cool, gruesome features. I counted up that he had around 250 hp, which I guess is a testament to the damage my chars. can do in a round. The XP is much, much better than the "good" route.

Still though, I thought Watcher's Keep was a nice little adventure. Cheers to the developers.

-Luther-

THE JAKER · Post by **THE JAKER** » Fri Oct 12, 2001 10:46 am

Luther, you might want to download the "Improved Tougher Demogorgon" patch from Balderdash, load up your savegame from before that battle, try it again, and give us your impressions on the difference in the two battles (since it is fresh in your mind). I'm assuming you were fighting the regular demo, correct me if I'm wrong. I never have fought the regular battle, only the improved, which I found to be somewhat hard but doable. (the same tactics are still the way to go.)

On my next try through TOB I am going to fight each of the bosses unimproved, then install the improved patch, fight the battle again, and note the differences.

Luther · Post by **Luther** » Fri Oct 12, 2001 11:04 am

Great point Jaker. I don't know why I didn't make the connection earlier considering the improved DG patch is all anyone mentions in earlier posts. I guess my stoked ego clouded my brain. (Consider it good role-playing since Luther is a meathead fighter with 9 Int.

)

I'll take on demo again. He deserves the respect.

-Luther-

THE JAKER · Post by **THE JAKER** » Fri Oct 12, 2001 11:32 am

Cool, let us know what differences you see.

BTW, I wasn't trying to be all like "yeah, but can you beat the IMPROVED Demo?!?!?!" I think it's funny how people get macho about a video game. I'm just curious how the two battles compare. I found with the improved that it was a fun battle and a good test, but I was able to do it IF my characters were rested, if they weren't I just didn't have enough resources left after doing the rest of the keep.

Xyx · Post by **Xyx** » Sat Oct 13, 2001 3:02 am

Originally posted by THE JAKER:
On my next try through TOB I am going to fight each of the bosses unimproved, then install the improved patch, fight the battle again, and note the differences.

My plan exactly.

Xandax · Post by **Xandax** » Sat Oct 13, 2001 2:37 pm

Originally posted by Luther the Hard:
Warning: spoiler ahead:

<snip>
I can't bring myself to go that easy route, I gotta kill him. My question is, is the XP the same? Better?

I got more XP for killing him than sealing him in- but at that point in the game what does around 20K XP per person mean

King Leoric · Post by **King Leoric** » Sat Oct 13, 2001 4:13 pm

Theres a post in here that teaches you to receive the most XP from demmy...

IIRC, it goes like this

1)Read the first scroll (80kXP/party member)

2)Agree with the demo and send the knights for him to kill them

3)Talk to them on the top of the keep and send them to death (you gave your word to the demogorgon, and even keldorn agrees that they deserve death for what they did to you)

4)Talk to the ghost of helm and agree to read a 2nd scroll (25k per party memeber)

5)Read the 2nd scroll to imprison the demogorgon (for 80k XP per party member) OUTSIDE THE KEEP, IN FRONT OF THE OPENED DOOR OF THE DEMOGORGON'S "LAIR".
I've done this and, due to a bug, THE DOOR DOESN'T CLOSE, SO THE KEEP ISN'T SEALED (apparently, helm's scroll wasn't all that good

)

6)Enter and kill that asdgjklasdhgklh, for 100k XP)

Yeah, i think that's it!!!! more than 285.000 XP per party member!!!!!

Xyx · Post by **Xyx** » Sun Oct 14, 2001 12:59 am

Devious!

Luther · Post by **Luther** » Mon Oct 15, 2001 2:33 pm

Thanks for the tip on the Improved DG patch. Man! That was a cool battle. Definitely more what I was expecting. They really don't need to tone down these battles. The arch-villains didn't get where they are by being weaklings. I was hoping there would be a desparate battle with a hoard of demons where you only survived by casting every spell and using every trick you have. It took me five re-loads but I finally timed it just right to take DG down.

The XP was good, one post I read said that you get 20K each after talking with the dying Odren, but I only got 20k total. The XP for killing all his minions made up for it though.

Which brings me to another point, after all the fireballs, whilting horrors, cloudkills and giant rampaging demons, how did the "dying Odren" manage to survive lying on the floor???

THE JAKER · Post by **THE JAKER** » Mon Oct 15, 2001 3:15 pm

Originally posted by Luther the Hard:
They really don't need to tone down these battles. The arch-villains didn't get where they are by being weaklings

So true. I think this is the sort of thing that the "difficulty" rating in configuration SHOULD be determining, instead of just making the same villains do more damage. In some games as you go up in level or difficulty you can play the same mission, but you get a time limit, or extra objectives that you have to fulfill for victory, or you're given less resources as you perform the mission. That kind of stuff also adds to replayability.

I think the improved Demo battle is "epic" and really stands out in your memory, you really get a sense of accomplishment when you see him go down.